E22 Lynsey Hooper and The Offside Rule
Hello it's ridiculous and you're listening to the unofficial partner podcasts. Welcome Lindsey Hooper's our guest this week. She's a sports journalist and broadcaster who who with Hayley McQueen and kate four say is one third of the offside rule regular presenting sky sports and for primarily productions we talked to Lindsey at the bonds offices in old street London as ever you can hear Sean Singleton the publisher of an official partner in the recording. If this is your first time with US feel free to dive Vinter Archive fire unofficial partner dot com where you can hear plenty of interviews with a wide range of guests from Charlie so rory solid Steve Martin Ed Smith. There's a lot there if you're a regular listener it'd be great if you could rate and review us on Itunes or wherever you listen to podcasts really helps other people find us thanks a lot and and his Lindsay Okay Lindsey who woke him to East London bombs offices today. Show US right now. Doing the ball is to from luxury. A tissue is very very very trendy so Lindsay this rule with that stall where to begin okay. Thanks very much for having me by the way we started actually in in vary three grand beginnings because it was the three of us myself capable say who worked for Sky News Sky Sports at the time majority in in sport but she also is a news journalist as well and Hailey McLean who's been a staple presenter now for many years on on Sky Sports News and the three of us all what what to sky sports at the same time so we would come across each other in the makeup room and we would talk football and we'd giggle and gotten very well and I don't think it really dawned on us until that big occasion happened. If you rewind about two hundred twelve there was the richer KS and Andy Gray sacking they've got dismissed from sky and it was over comments of of women fundamentally maybe not knowing the offside rule which really hurts us because we thought well not only of you insulted all women to say that they possibly couldn't understand why they involved in football which is effectively what that message seemed to say but you've also insulted insult us as colleagues now we work here we work in football and in particular. Haley who's very held in high esteem there and and sending one of their fluctuate presenters then you think wow is that is that really the hidden feeling and if that's what our colleagues are thinking what are the audience thinking yet we really we do stuff you know this and there are people and I think that happens with with men and women there are people that black it there are people that maybe don't know as much but actually most most people that have a real passion or certain dedicate as much of their lives something as as any of us have usually know about it and we knew that just from those conversations stations we tied in the makeup room and so I had come from a in particular come from a radio background so a little bit ahead of the game in terms of knowing about podcast 'cause because back then they weren't very popular and they were still starting out. I think only football ramble really was going at that time and I just said let these guys are doing this and and that didn't really well but we have a women and what we have an opinion for. I change not just a script that we're reading from something why we really get to show and demonstrate demonstrate that we we know what we're talking about said that is where it was born from and what was the keys ricky amy grain moment that was saw that talk to seem to the outside team seemed to culture question within sky was that what was it like because it seemed to be the most. Ludi fish environment of of my experience wasn't great. I'M NOT GONNA deny it but I think it has changed Salat since I left for the better and of course Haley still there and I know I know from speaking to her how brilliant is now on many levels and it needed to be because when I was there the was just too much emphasis on looks for the women and and not enough about knowledge and it pretty much for me came down to the fact the I was up for a job and someone who knew nothing about football got it and I was taught told could isis dynasties or anywhere could work on my head rather than working on my Hatami look it. They thought they'd work on the other person's knowledge which they didn't so. I that was the final Straw for me really because I knew that I didn't have that typical what I would say typical but there was a Scott Sports News Lug. I guess I was always hopeful that eventually it would move on and I mike and I really did with my boss in particular at the time I really wanted to wear them with my knowledge of football and I remember on a few occasions grilling me about Lower League teams in the answers and him him below well and it would be she knows her stuff. Maybe we put out with the wind in your hair. Remember that saying you know my Miami podcast. 'cause some people might be listening. Think my God she might be the back end of a bus. I'm not that bad I might hey. I think hi mcclay Bali Francis call credit for that. In terms of the change in that was a big decision at the time get rid of he's great was that was a huge decision and and a lot of people really love them and that would have been quite a decision to make but I think it started what has become now a the advent of women in football I still I still think there are issues. I still think that everyone is trying to do the right thing and it's brilliant and I'm seeing so many more faces and voices and I think that's great each but in terms of some of the colleagues that I looked up to because we all have that take me when we come into a business that we have role models and some of the people that I looked up to. I just don't see enough enough of now and I'm like what is that. Is that Class Tomlinson. She is still working but she was a pioneer sue coming down on a little bit in age probably Jackie o people like that inject. Jackie's just join sky but that's great to say but I don't feel like I see enough of those the people that really pave the way for me to be able to do. I do and I think that might be an age thing and that really concerns me because I think that's the next thing that needs addressing because it's great getting in as many entry level and I'm and I'm living that you know the offside rule. We often reach out and try and get new people in from universities. Give them that I experience and some of them have gone onto brilliantly and really well. Am I feel like my responsibility now. Turn into the people that are older than me and I'm I'm probably a bit of that is selfish as well as safeguarding my own future because you worry as well you know the government is telling us about seventy probably all be maybe even older and won't be the what what's the what you see now because we're in this obviously coming off the back of the women's. World Cup and everyone here that loss people launched coached sort of women focused media crop products go from the Telegraph and you can sort of see that there is something happening and then and in the sponsorship market always overblown reaction to that they will vote on who knows great but what's still to be done. Well I think from a marketing point of view. That's starting to get it right. I mean you go to Stamford Bridge now and you will see a huge photo in the club shop of Frank Kirby equal to what you would have lassie's scene of huge absolutely brilliant and you walk through the cheap heap stations and the water the football station and you see posters images but I would say that they are one of very few clubs that have managed to to do that and putting more resources into marketing but why would we talk about marketing and there is still teams that aren't even fully professional. You know that's where the money needs to go first because we need our players to have an equal paine field and not isn't an equal paying field. That's just the ability to be able to do this as a full time job and that still isn't the case up and down. The country is getting so much better. We have a professional league. We've seen leaks to up around Europe and around the world where now I players can also go abroad. You know we've seen big news for Lucy bronze to Leon and seeing Tony token who went to Barcelona Madrid. There are those opportunities but I think it starts with the the fact that the sport sport isn't a good place but then the next thing is that you have to get that message out to an audience and that does come with backing it comes with sponsors coming on board and and and also wanting to be a part of the journey now we look at working with brands all the time on podcast and what we want is is a very good but they're not as good as the totally football shores the football ramble but what we want is someone who will work with us because they want to grow with us and we've been there in the beginning you especially in women's football and we want people who want to be part of that. It's not just a sponsor thing. It's not just here's some money and at Brown gets all of this the back of it and you get this off the back of it. I think it's a now about relationships and people working together and I think that's what needs to happen. In football to eight needs to be when these brands come on board that they're in for the long term and I think continental tires were very good because they're still they're doing Esi they they. They put their name to women's. Fa Cup in is still there so those are the sorts of broadens that I think people need to follow. It's no good coming in on the whim of the back of the really successful World Cup and thinking oh well. This is the time to run too but it's like anything that you've got a bit of momentum and grows news so quickly because it has done is that you do also have you fraud so you have you people and I'm not talking about bronze per se but I'm talking about. Maybe those people in the head above the parapet sniffing. Maybe this is a good time to become a women's football agent own. You know whatever is you can get that. I think from success so it's about having the responsible people in those really higher positions as well how that can really guy people and clubs not only just players clubs and also. I think there's a huge responsibility now as it does the FAA is there oh my next door. WHO's Edison's. She worked night. He tried to get an extension completely kitchen. The that there are people magazine the been toiling away for years and years. It just feels the World Cup is a cliche disabled. I feel like hey moment where there was a sort of time and you saw people generally talking about wounds. Football wasn't a sort of patronizing at all. They're playing looking. Isn't it great which always had there is always going to be a group of food mentality. But do you think that was a change yeah. It was hard for me to judge because I was out there so I was with the England team and I was very much in that little a bit of a bubble with them because I was working directly for fever so I wasn't seen as the press. If you like is seen as their press we were in their hotels and I had a very different role and apart from checking on social media and things I didn't I want the pickup was I saw different. Different announcements in terms of viewing figures Shaka's which we're incredible so I thought well something's happening but I think the re the real moment home to me was speaking to my family and my parents because my mom watched men's football for as long as I have no that's probably where it comes from sending comes from Granddad but I know that they're avid watches coaches and actually I date my name and shame in that. My mom is always said to me. She didn't like me playing football and she didn't really like women's. You know that you could never tell me why it was just that and she started talking to me about it. She watched three four different matches and was talking about it the way she talked to me about it when she watches much of the day and I thought that's a new level because if that's my own Mommy I've known all my life and I've known her attitude then that's that's incredible but not only that I was talking to friends who would overhead ahead conversations in pubs umbrellas and on the street and walk into the chief station and I think that was appealed to the popular masses now now. I think that was a little bit of timing with these with these things. It's always like that. You know it was maybe a slightly quieter summer which meant new it also got terrestrial terrestrial coverage and you needed those things to come together to actually show you know what is pretty good. It's pretty good standard and you are going to be entertained. There are stories and more importantly. I think the thing that everybody got sold on is that you you hear the stories of the players and you like them and you want them to do while a new really invest in them and I did I mean I knew quite a lot of the old alliances and I've known some struggles in their tails and then you've got the younger ones coming through are you and I I didn't know them as well you likes of Georgia stemware and Williamson Mary ups and all these other ones that I hadn't actually spoken to as much and and I really fell for them. I know you guys deserve this as well and I wondered if there would be a little bit of a I wanted to say entitlements battlements because I think we may be judged the younger generations and things that they have that in them a little bit and there wasn't all there was nothing but gratitude and feeling really blessed to be there and wanting to create some new role models for the future and to actually make a difference. You can tell that isn't just about tame football for them. They actually want to really onto the next generation's come in three they could you see them all that generation it was a new cast of characters and you can sort of see people as you say latching onto the developing relationships with them. We were always told years and years and years we're in spore generally women's football people particularly. It's not telling because it's not popular and then it on telly and it becomes popular that sort of peculiar. It's such a difficult one because you know what men's football probably did cross absolutely did because of the money involved that transition shen onto paywall television which is what I would call it so but I think it's one of very few things that has I think it's a different argument what we're actually talking about is wealth and class and who's got enough money to be able to pay for these things and who puts that as the priority the in they'll in their life at the moment because we could get into a whole other debate about the pressures on different people's as an average family two point four what you've got going on in your life and where does the sky sports subscription come in that anymore or the bts or the freeview or the Amazon all these different things that are coming through true and there was a calculation ahead of this season. This is just if you were primarily or men's football fan. WanNa Watch maybe a bit of Syria Aruna leaguer there as well and the amount of subscriptions. You would need to watch potentially or even your team see. I'm a wolves fan. If I wanted to watch all of wolves matches you know in Europe at at home in Cup matches. How many things have I got to be subscribe to and I think we put in a big burden on people just the average family and remember but that football was just a working class boards. That's where it came from and now you've got to be pretty rich. You've got to be pretty rich to go as a as a season ticket get hauled into some of the huge clubs in the Premier League and you've got to be pretty rich to what you all at home now so you're asking someone to choose maybe between a gym membership shippen staying healthy and watching sports or in some cases between the Wheatley shop how much they're going to send a difficult one. I I think just maybe it's been priced out and I think the terrestrial offering if you put anything on terrestrial it will get a better audience than you. Put it behind the pay paywall. That's that's it isn't it again. We're consuming things. In different ways where it's I woke whoa couple of clips on on in various places in the thirty second highlight moments and I'm wondering if fat replace it I mean much of the days and having this conversation with some people in the sort of meat sports media rights mock and they're saying well actually highlights programmes of really really hard to sell out of the matter is they still and it's probably an outline is probably not typical of highlights spall and actually what we're seeing is that there's a premium we live it live moment still in certain categories but then everything else is going to be sort of discount diced and we're. GonNa conceived screens on phones from your be. Your new interesting because you all working both alm and the sort of television but you also work with pre league and and essentially a IMG's yet yeah deal with them yet. How does that work just thinks yeah well they. If you imagine that the fight that happens in this country for right to the Premier League as we've seen in recent years as being between bt Sport and sky sports what what primarily productions do is they provide the rights holders around the rest of the world with content so they provide them with the live matches of whoever buys him whether they're in cute actually can pick up on the on the one. That's isn't he three countries. It depends on whether they're in Cambodia seventy whether they're in Australia whether they're in Asia whether they're in the Middle East whoever is that sport those rights then get a lot of our footage so that as well as the live as much as they will have content around that so they have many different shows fun fun zone is one of them which is a fun orientated program and they have premier the league today which sometimes has journals on there is a huge offering and that that content goes out and I guess for pretty much most of the world they might afford the riots but they might not be able to afford the content making around it so as ready made so often. If you're in a hotel room you know people will often Siemian bizarre places around the world my family since I left Central News in in Birmingham which was the local TV station still we. I mean what are you doing. Where are you K- because they just don't ever get sick so from that point of view you really wish that the offering was available in the UK as well but that's what they do and that's who I work for and if you look at world feeds is a little bit like a tournament when World Cup or a euros you'll have someone who does the wealthy distribution. You've got to look at them as a bit like that because they should be or the off the pitch interviews and then the rights holders will always get their their chance to do to do a lot yes which everyone's now heard because they are so everyone's like now. I know what you when you said St Louis Park everyone's talking about it. I grew up a couple of miles and the idea has become the center of the debate. They said everyone is just so bizarre. Factory Taylor's still view. It's like glamour well it is it's a big industrial. Austrian state where a glamorous one and there's lots of other different units on that but they have huge building with really great studios at me a he throw Safi move. I think for the future because they're going to have crossed rail going through as soon as that's been running this going to be a direct link in an out tells crashing in Oxford. It's about the only thing going for then. What would you grow up. I grew up Ned Dudley and the black country. I am my parents black country through and through. They lived in next villages. Each other at a local purpose is to go when I was only just old enough so a very close knit family that black country lifestyle the family tend to be with a remnant baton mile or so radius. Everyone knows a lot by every day and it's a lovely community and everyone is just superb we now. I love going home and chatting to people that that brilliant brilliant people USA country. You're talking suit. They say off to a degree they are they are they are in the sense. That is like going back in time. When I go home you know not that much. Che's moved on things. Do things do move on but not the right that they've moved on in cities and in places like London and Manchester and Bristol still in places like that so it's just a lovely village atmosphere and I and I was an only child as well so I very much felt like I grew up with you in cotton wool a little bit because I I got fareed everywhere to go and pay so many different sports. I was just a sports fanatic and I didn't even think twice about the fact that you know my Dad Dad was always after factory job where he'd been working for hours and hours physically labor he was like holding machinery and then I'd be asking him to romy here in every way and he just stayed I had brilliant relationship with my granddad and my granddad used to be a sculpted wolves and was a very good football club. The Wall came name one of those and it was just infectious and and I did not realize how how great I had it when it came into football because since and all my colleagues I've met in recent years. I didn't realize I got to play football at school. Not Many people ah not many female colleagues of mine did when school they didn't have the offering my mic school absolutely off at the high school. My teacher actually played for Wolverhampton wondrous wondrous ladies so I knew about women's football for a long time and my non on my other side that wasn't even really wouldn't have said that. She was that spore say she was my old grandma. Every Saturday without much of the day on in it was just what we were brought up with and I didn't think I was unusual until I I left and went to university and talks about football. A lot of people and people be like Beena. You really liked football and you talk about quite love love. I went to left yeah. It's a school related decision was up. Yes I was GonNa am I used to do cross country running and I was that crazy kid that wanted to be out there in all sorts of weather in Raynham merged and running through streams and a pales downhills any the personal focus well at least jolly sale is he also an ex student. It was about time said he was he was he was there. We've Sep- cub yet and that was when became the sort of big sporting universe. Yes yes well. This is the only child my moment guide me radius of one hundred miles and the one hundred like pretty much. I think it was eighty. Does something miles from where I lived so I took as much as I could. I actually raced at lift for when I was fourteen in. I think it was schools race of some sort or oh county race. I loved it and that was pinned on my hopes I WANNA go here. This is the Sporting meca this is where I belong. I want to come here but the the irony being that the moment I stepped foot in my sports sort of took a backseat because they had the amazing media facilities and I'd already discovered of a hospital radio back in Dudley and I'd already been doing quite a lot of volunteering and community radio and so I walked straight in there and that that was my new passion if you like so I look back on love burn a lot of people say makes or breaks you as a sports person and I think I left I went there is one thing and left leftovers something else what love for them so central toe visuals that no central television came a little bit later. I was so I had a radio AH immediate radio when I was younger just because I don't think there were many female voices. I just had a really good run. Everyone talks about look in this industry and I just had it when it came to my early career in radio because I was broadcasting on on the local student radio station it left commercial station heard me because it happened beyond the the local. RS L. License which everyone in the local area could hear it and they were after someone for that breakfast show and they called up up the university. Who is this person she sounding pretty good. Could we get her own show. So I was like roving reporter and then my second year I ended up my own show which has like a late night love show which my mother's maiden name his love so I wanted to change it to Lindsay love and until I signed a bit too porn star esque so and and then I went on Seabrook so yeah and music and I went to trends. FM in Nottingham in what on weekends there the my first proper commercial job was I got weekend. Breakfast on a station cooled heroin. FM and the first guy to give me my proper bright was gentlemen cool pull green. I mean he was the program control at the time I think I've badgered him with demos and he was just like let's just give her something and it went from. Mary did Virgin Megastores Radio which doesn't exist anymore but they used to. Tottenham Court road have this huge stole and a glass studio and I used to present in there and made some friends for life life when I did that job. It was brilliant. I used to be Alan Partridge. Ask Go to Norwich once a week for a radio show but I loved it. enrage was my love that was that was the thing that I got sucked into the media industry because I just loved radio is a format and then the already being from when we were talking at the very beginning about my experience with sky and things was that one of my my bosses just said let you you're not the back end of verse. Your Yard. Why have you thought about television and and radio was going through a lot of changes at that time with network all the shows and a lot of local local stations nations losing breakfast shows and drive time shows and I could see the writing on the wall really that you got to be already a celebrity really to get on there are the exceptions exceptions of course and and I just always the whole point of going to left brewers wanting to do sports journalism. I spoke in English. That was what I wanted to do and I thought I've lost sight of that a little. Ah Bit whipped up in the going to the awards and doing those sorts of jobs and then I thought that was the best time to do it. I was in my early twenties time now to choose and go for something and so you really I focused on sport from about twenty three twenty four bruce forward to the future. The Assad rule gathering pace is gathering pace is I'm excited by it. Because of that creative freedom I think any brew pastor just will take grab the five hundred because the moment that you get the chance to set the agenda know what you're talking about and have that freedom and also with people that you really love is exciting so we are expanding in the sense that we are no longer just gonNa have the offside rule wants to wait. We're GONNA have aws addition for the nieces and so we don't you know women's warm and we still do our exclusive which sit downs with with people from the world of football players manages former players manages an even commentators taste had martin tighter on one so we try and and plug that happen put our aspen which is different. I would even even say you know for our podcast. Now we've ended more into life style of genre when our chat radio as well so they just break like the show up so they just love the podcast and they were just so on point with where we are. Probably you probably a different collaborations that you look at and you think how would I make that work but this was just an easy one it was you know they have a big emphasis on female female. Mel Musicians and that playlist female and US being female talking about football. It was really easy fit and they said you know there's nothing really we want to do any different. We'll just break up and put it out as a show but the business part of me was like well you can't have it on listen again because then obviously the podcast becomes redundant so they have it lie edit last live if you like airing on a Friday night and then they repeat it on the Saturday morning but they can release it as they listen again or cousin. Apercus still exists zillions for our audience is it's odd because it's probably still slightly male skewed but we probably have the highest female she added. If any the football podcast I think we're about forty percents forty to forty five women but still have majority is man and I really liked that I really like because I think what what it's saying is that I'm not. I am a feminist but I'm not a feminist. She wants to Bang Drummond exclude man. That's not what it's is about working together and just about everybody having equal opportunities and so if people are listening to us and liking what we've got to say. I didn't think it really matters what gender you are interesting. We always asked about that split and I'm just so actually anyone who enjoys it age age range. We're probably looking at anywhere between I think we're little bit older than the youth. Youth wants to like twenty five to forty. Five is tends to be our audience but they're very engaging. That's the one thing is that we get a lot of engagement. There's a lot of different shows that maybe people don't hear from their audience but we we do and when people find they let us know which is really nice the wolves yeah. I've had years and years if you're talking to me at the High uh-huh yeah you're talking to me at the high I mean I beam from an when I talk about wolves and actually probably disgracefully though let you listen to many of the because I it didn't really talk about them that much because we did the double drop it was always doom and gloom and I'm never hid the fact that I was born since the recent ascendancy ascendancy quite a bit. It's the Best Wolves team that I've seen in my lifetime and I didn't think that day was gonNA come. I've got a very good friend who is Australian and she spent most of her time. Working Germany is huge by Munich found in Germany congressional team from those two things and she'd seen how team win the Champions League and she'd seen her team win the World Cup in her lifetime and I just this was never going to get and then England went and got to the semi finals of the World Cup both men women and and then wolves went on this great run in that debut season back in there primarily finished seventh and now we're playing European football which I've not seen at Mullen youth for a my life so really good manager yeah interesting yeah. He's very good. I do worry that someone is miss. We'll penn some point for him. Against share you well is probably you the CEO is gone yeah. Okay well. Listen Awesome. Thanks very much. Your time really enjoyed that yeah. I really enjoy air and won't you didn't yeah please. Dave please stay Hi this. She's pulled hawks. Being an unofficial partner is my dirty little secret apart from the buck plug obviously and.