UFO, Gray Barker, CIA discussed on Joel Riley

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Personal feeling about your foes are would be in visited not throughout there were they're not out there? What do you think? Yes. To all of those. I think that. People are experiencing especially with the closer encounter cases. They're experiencing only a fraction of what's actually going on with them. I know that's not particularly satisfactory answer. When I started. I thought the same thing that most people that were Ufology enthusiasts thought that they were visitors from well at that time Mars was still considered remote that was spot. Right. Yeah. Well, it was a spotless sky that looked red. And you could see these canals which strangely disappear when you get up close, which is an interesting thing in and of itself. But are there extraterrestrial visitors possible? Absolutely, do I think that that is where the UFO cases are coming from. Absolutely not. Because of what I mentioned before. I think that the notion that we're being visited from else where is probably better phrased as we're being visited from else else. What which means I think that we are so close to other dimensional structures other membranes that are totally different from our own. It's much more likely that you foes, and the beings that are associated with them and quipped, it's and. Go send a number of other phenomena are are actually coming from a much closer to us. Then then let's say from alpha centauri would be the most credible place because that's four light years away. And it's conceivable that they must've learned how to bend space and time. Well, yeah, they would have to bin space and time, and if you've been space and time, then you're talking about dimensional things. And if you're talking about energy mention things, you're already conceding the point that there are inter dimensional space. You know, if you you can't just blithely do a Star Trek thing and say, oh, we go into hyperspace. What is hyper space? I mean, I I understand the term. But but it basically means that there are shortcuts outside of the universe as we understand the universe. Well, if there are and that enables extra. Terrestrial travel. It also means that inter dimensional travel from a much closer source is entirely possible. One of the things that has puzzled me over the years. Georgia's is that at the very beginning. If you fall in I don't go go back quite that far. I got actively involved in nineteen sixty of course, it was about fifteen years before that that the the awareness of the phenomenon came to public view as we now understand it. I think it's as old as the earth, actually. The first thing that people said other than oh, these are just conventional phenomena that misunderstood are hoaxes or otherwise explained in conventional terms kind of the Cy cop. Explanation for things the first thing that people jump to was belief in flying saucers from other worlds. And I wonder why the leap immediately to that. There isn't any clear reason, no one has ever seen UFO traveling from another planet. They're all seen here or very close to the earth. And that suggests to me that they are a product of our own environment. Do I think that there's a conventional explanation? Absolutely not. No, I think there is a very very unconventional explanation, and I sort of alluded to that. And the fact is most of the nuts and bolts ufologist, they pull their hair out when they hear about that. Because they're they're convinced that these are machines, very like the Mars Rovers only a little more advanced than that. And that they are from elsewhere in the known universe and for for the life of me. I don't understand why that particular leap, I also wonder about the term belief in that context. Belief doesn't fit into my picture of the subject at all. I can check sure I hypothesize, but belief is something that seems to be out of the religious universe. And there's nothing wrong with religious universe. But that's why the psychologist Carl. Young was interested in in you photos. It's not that he thought that they didn't have a some kind of objective existence. But the excitement over it was clearly a new era belief system with all the trappings of a new religion. I kind of expected that it would become that and for few people that has, but I think we need to look beyond the e t h the extraterrestrial hypothesis into things like inter dimensional transfers that take place, and if that also leads to some notion that there's a way to skip space even between star systems even between galaxies because distance is no object. If you're talking about some sort of outside of the universe. Verse property, which you can go into and then come out of where you want to which is really what what people are talking about the hypothesized that then maybe the two or the same thing including inclination is to say, hey, we're here they're here. So why think of them as being from you know, a galaxy far far away. They don't need to be. You've investigated men in black situations who or what are they? Well there. There are a few cases mostly from the nineteen fifties. This is a very key point, by the way that I think because of the nineteen fifty three CI panel on UFO's that concluded it really wasn't looking into whether they were real or not whatever you define as real. They were more concerned about the fact. That in the the July nineteen fifty two cases. Which by the way, was the first one I have ever heard about which was my father saying flying saucers over the Pentagon. And that just a great story. My little six year old ears. You know? So I must've been a born in into Ufology are on reincarnation of a previous Ufology, but in any case in all seriousness. I think that the CIA panel was most concerned about the fact that all of the warning systems that we had to protect us from Soviet attack. Whether such was actually in the works or not. Were overridden, by UFO cases during that that period the filter centers for the civilian ground observer corps, which was a civilian thing to spot enemy bombers or something that was you know, is stated now, but was who was a useful tool back then and the the the call centers that were receiving information on anything that was an identified like, whether it was a bomber or whether it was a craft from alpha centauri, or whatever it was jammed every if we had been attacked that. Weekend. It would have been a surprise attack. And we would have been caught off guard because the phone lines were jammed shirt. Radar was looking for flying saucers rather than for. So the CIA concluded that private UFO organizations, and you have to be, you know, nineteen fifties. Think here to understand their involved, but UFO private organizations could be infiltrated by communist agents. I know this sounds a little weird. Yeah. But this is you know, this is the CIA nineteen fifty two which is still relevant a communist under every rock. Yes. Communists under the rock where parents interested in flying saucer groups in order to generate sake UFO reports in order to to duplicate the jam up that took place in July fifty two over JC. And because the CIA said that they recommended that the government break up private UFO groups shortly after that. A number of private UFO groups were visited by intimidating people who they interpreted or later people like my late friends. I agree Barker interpreted as the men in black the problem with that theory, if you carry it forward is first of all we're not in that kind of era anymore. The CIA panel was you know, I was probably was before you were born was six at the time. I it's it's not relevant now. But the men in black keeps showing up, and in fact, as I've delved into it. There are men in black cases going back to antiquity. So clearly that wasn't the CIA recommendations that that government agents scare other scarier private Ufologists out of business. Also, most of the witnesses to men in black cases are not Ufologists. They are. In fact, witnesses. Either to you have. Okay, ses cryptic cases, are some other strange phenomena and a few days later, the blackout kids show up at their door or slender man shows up or classically the three men in black when I look at this in depth naturally. I turn to the Albert bender K switch tell us that. Well, okay. So bender was from Bridgeport, Connecticut, he just passed on very recently. He was World War Two vet had an interest in science fiction. He also had an interest in flying saucers, and he set up the I believe it's called the international flying saucer bureau if came and went before my time, but. Unknown to most of the people who have had something to say about his case. And he's practically every traditional book on UFO's talks about it though for starting with gray Barker's, they knew too much about flying saucers, which was published just a couple of years later. I believe in the nineteen fifty six if I remember, right and keel who I also knew very well. And and practically everybody has has mentioned that case if they're at all involved in this. They talk about. As if he were bender was investigating UFO's with this probably two hundred member. If that flying saucer group got visited by people who scared the bejesus out of him, and he shut down the bureau and would not talk about UFO's ever again, supposedly he wrote a book called flying saucers in the three men some years later, but he didn't right. It's a great Barker wrote, it it was like she got credit for I guess. Well, Barker didn't get credit for it. But he credited bender with it because it was bender story. But as as as published by gray Barker, and gray was profound person. But he was also a bit of a trickster, and, you know, not to speak ill of the dead because he was one of my best friends. But he I I was told by multiple sources, maybe even by gray himself. You know, basically, he wrote the book, however, does it matter bender moved to the west. Coast and was involved with classical music. He was involved with an orchestra leaving LA and he passed on just a couple of years ago. However, missing from all that is the fact that in addition to his interest in science fiction and in flying saucers. I mean, I don't think the term UFO said even been invented at that point. He was also an occultist and a practitioner of a cult ceremonial magic. I never fully realized that even though it's it's the the parameters of his visitation when I saw a picture of his home. I group of pictures, actually, which were not widely published a gray Barker published late in his life and shortly before his own tragic and premature death, although not under mysterious circumstances at all he published these photos in a very small circulation book, and when I enhance them and blew them up. I could clearly see as an occultist myself that this guy Albert k bender was practicing ceremonial magic. And once I saw that I thought. Because he had an altar. He had various occult symbols. He had the the entire repertoire and a time when that was exceedingly rare that was a dead period for the occult the nineteen fifties and early nineteen sixties. It was just dead that there were maybe a handful of people worldwide that had any interest in that whatsoever. Some of the periphery like astrology, and so forth have always had a following. But you couldn't even buy a terro deck other than well. Even the other than the one that the church of light in an offspring of the hermetic brotherhood of light issued which was a black and white little deck with Japan type symbols on it. They just didn't exist until sometime in the early nineteen sixties one deck, the the one associated with the hermetic order of the golden dawn was reprinted. It in a rather. Nice addition by. University books if I remember correctly. When we come back. I wanna ask you what your favorite UFO cases of all times what it may be. There are lots of them that are out there. But I wanna get your favorite. And of course, we'll take phone calls next with Allen greenfield. So we'll open up the phone lines. You're your foe stories and definitely your questions. He's an expert. He's an investigator. And he's a darn good. One is books include the complete secret cipher of the UFO nuts. God never does the same thing. Twice messiahs and miracle workers and all of that linked up to his Facebook account, which is linked up at coast to coast AM dot com. And you can like us at Facebook as well. We'll be back in a moment on coast to coast AM find out more about tonight's guest. Log on to coast to coast AM dot com. Atalay know where America's five.

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