JOE, Joe Hunter, Ricky Lake discussed on Happy Mama Movement with Amy Taylor-Kabbaz


Here Amy. Thank you for having me. We have known each other for a while. We have walked a rather random path to this moment. You I don't even remember how I was introduced to you when I moved to Sydney, but you did the photographs for my first website and the cover of my first book. Photographs, I still use. And I absolutely adore with being at events together around birthing and motherhood. We have you took photos of my sister like there's this waving. There's a weaving of our stories, but now it's waving back together again because of this phenomenal. And I really don't use that word lightly. Phenomenal documentary that you have brought to the world with a number of other women called birth time. So first of all, I just want to say, wow, congratulations. What a phenomenal contribution to make. How did this all start? Thank you. Thanks, love. Well, look, it started four and a half nearly 5 years ago. Possibly before that. So Joe hunter, who is a private practicing midwife and a dear friend of mine started working together we started working together maybe I don't know 6 or 7 years ago. So I'm a doula and the birth photographer and videographer. And we started working together and became friends and started talking about films and Joe Joe 11 years ago had hosted the Australian premiere of the business of being born, which was is a film made by Ricky Lake and Abby Epstein about essentially about the American maternity system. And Ricky came out and Joe hosted the premiere of it in Australia and she was really excited about it. And a lot of people loved it, but said, but that that's what happens in America. And Joe thought this no, it doesn't. This is what's happening here. It might be slightly different, but we're on the same path. And so from that point, she had she had this kernel of an idea to make an Australian documentary based on our maternity system. Anyway, so a few years down the track, Joe and I became close and we started talking about it and we spoke with a few people and then it just seemed that between the two of us we didn't quite have enough knowledge and know how and, you know, context, you kind of make that happen. We had the knowledge of, you know, the system and the industry and the people. We just, it was more the film side of things. So anyway, fast forward then to May 2016 Zoe nayla, who is an actress and her partner Aaron Jeffrey, they booked Joe to be their home birth midwife and booked me to be their doula and birth videographer. And it was Zoe's second baby. She'd had her first baby in what on paper looked like a very straightforward birth center birth. But when she then went through the care of Joe, had a home birth with her second baby bow. At home with Joel and I supporting her, she came out the other side, feeling just absolutely incredible. And she couldn't believe how different she felt from the care that she'd had in that birth compared to the kid that she'd had in her first birth in reflection. She looked back to her first birth and realized that she had come out of it with postnatal depression. She'd come out of it feeling lost and alone and not really knowing what had happened to her. And we then talked to her about our idea of this documentary and we showed her the business of being born and she just said, I mean, we're doing it. Let's go. And literally that was that was the sprouting of the seed. Just and it went from there. So that was May 2016. We gathered equipment. We bought equipment. We taught ourselves. We had absolutely no money to put towards it. So we had to learn everything ourselves, so we brought sound and lighting. I had cameras. And we just started, and we started with the beautiful Hannah Darwin, I was pregnant with my first baby at the time. And we started with Hannah dallin and. A stroke of well, what we would now call madam birth time brilliance years out. She is our guarding light. Hannah darling was organizing the normal labor and birth conference with travels around the world and it happened to be on in Sydney two weeks after we interviewed her. And she said, I will give you access to anyone at that conference. And so Joe and I had tickets to the conference. We didn't end up seeing any of the conference at all because we sat in a room up in the conference venue and had a private audience with all of the keynote speakers from all over the world. And then we suddenly had, you know, I don't know, maybe 8 interviews under our belt, and we were away. So that was the week before I gave birth to Rudy. So that was October 2016. And so that's how it all really started. And it just went from there and it's been one of those projects that's just flown. It's just it's guided us along the way. We haven't had to drive it. The people that we needed to interview have just effortlessly come to us. And no one has said no, and it's just been this amazing creation that has unfolded in front of us. But that's how it happens when it's meant to be. Exactly. Call it madam birth time. And it does get its own energy. I feel the same way about my work at times. Right back from the beginning, though, did you know where it was going to go? Did you have a clear conclusion you wanted to make? And how and if that changed over the time, we didn't have a plan for it at all. We knew when you at the key of it, the question we created from the beginning and asked everyone we interviewed was what would it take for women to emerge from their births, feeling physically well and emotionally safe? So we knew that, you know, we know that that old story that everyone gets told all that matters is a healthy baby. It doesn't matter about the journey, all that matters is the outcome of having a healthy baby. And the onus is always on the health of the baby, which of course, of course, is, you know, so important. But to discredit the emotional and physical outcomes of the mother is very, very careless. And we knew when we lined that up with, for example, Zoe's story of, you know, coming out of her birth and she was well in her baby was well, but she wasn't doing so great emotionally, mentally, psychologically. You know, that was the difference. And we knew and she knew. She was astounded by the difference in the care of having one to one midwifery care throughout her whole pregnancy birth and postnatal period. And so we essentially knew that this was the answer, because all of the studies lead to that. All of the studies say one to one midwifery care, right throughout the journey, brings better outcomes for mothers and babies. So that was our underlying drive through the whole thing. And, you know, so we formulated that question to ask people what contributing factors fed into this. So we had absolutely no plan for how the documentary would look in the end,.

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