Peter Navarro, Polio Vaccine, Flu Vaccine discussed on Here & Now


Listeners and members of the Public Radio Bay Area today. Some morning cloudiness along the coast in bay, mostly sunny, further inland highs in the sixties to near 90 possibly today in the Bay Area. Guys 92 to 100 again in the Sacramento Valley in the Bay Area, areas of smoke and haze in parts of the Bay Area due to the mineral fire and personal county. From NPR and W bur. I'm Tanya. Mostly, I'm Jeremy Hobson. It's here and now Shares of companies hit hard by the pandemic jumped this morning on Wall Street after news of a major development in the race for a Corona virus vaccine. Vaccine in development by the biotech company, Madonna produced protective antibodies in all 45 people who participated in phase one trials. There were side effects to the vaccine, but it was ultimately deemed safe and is now set to move into the next phase, which will include tens of thousands of participants. Stat news reporter Matthew Harper has been covering this story in math. You start by explaining the significance of the modern, a vaccine being proven safe in the early trials, so people like to say that phase one trials are about safety and later trials are about efficacy, but really safety and ethics here kind of studied in tandem. The two things that researchers were really looking for. Here were safety. You want to make sure the side effects aren't so onerous to the vaccine couldn't be used. And to figure out if the vaccine is producing antibodies, which is We think potentially of whether the vaccine will be effective at preventing infection. We mentioned that there have been side effects thes were mitigated by the lowering of the vaccine dose. But can you describe what those side effects were? Sure, I mean the kind of side effects you get from an immune response. One thing people get seemed to get confused about is Does the vaccine give you the virus? It doesn't. This vaccine produces a protein. That is part of the virus. But it's not the whole virus, so there's no way it could make you sick in the way the virus does, and at the dose that's life to go forward here. There were some systemic side effects for just about everybody, Some kind of headache, some kind of pain and some people with fevers. I want to go back to what you were saying about. Safety and efficacy. You say that the volunteers for this trial had the antibodies, which is critical. Do we know whether that response is strong enough to prevent infection? No, we don't know that. We can only know that by doing Very large studies where we see if people get infected or not. Those studies are beginning. One thing that I think is very important People remember is that there are 23 vaccines in human trials. And the good news is that Several of them seem to be progressing, which increased the odds that will have vaccines. Next year. If not by the end of this year. I mean, it really speaks to the AU, knowing that the number of people who will eventually get this vaccine will be large. How careful do researchers have toe Me too, actually get it right this time, So we probably need a bigger debate them were having about how we're going to use these vaccines when they become available. Do they go to First responders first, do we give? The first fact seemed to get to everybody Remember there are a lot of vaccines coming out and they may have different profiles. There's this tendency in the pandemic to think about having a vaccine is this magic bullet? But you know, we're hoping for a vaccine is about 75% effective, the FDA said a Bard about 50% That's not like the measles vaccine where you give it and your odds of getting the disease are nothing. It would make a huge difference in the spread of covert 19. Yeah, actually was thinking of it in terms of a measles vaccine or a polio vaccine that prevents those diseases or do we expect something like the flu vaccine? Where It confers some immunity, but in many cases only serves to reduce the severity of the illness. For some patients, you don't know these things until you do a phase three trial. Things do fail with some regularity. There are huge surprises. Because biology's really complicated you mentioned face three for Moderna. They're set to study this beginning July 27th with 30,000 patients. That's really an astronomical number compared to the 45 people in the phase one trial. What are some of the concerns with with a child of this size? Well because of the pressing need every company developing vaccines, and the JJ is skipping. Normal stages that you would take in development. That probably doesn't pose some gigantic safety risk, but there could be rare side effects. You need to have a big enough sample size that you can take those up. But the other problem is we want to figure out if the's vaccines prevent infection, and so you need to either follow people for a very long time or follow a lot of people. We don't have time. So we're following a lot of people, and that's true for the Madonna vaccine. It's true for the Oxford vaccine that's being developed with AstraZeneca as we learn more You know, we'll we'll have a better sense of whether an antibody response is indicative that the vaccine is going to work. It sounds astronomical, but it's actually not unheard of trial size, but perhaps the first time that the world is watching As it happens in real time that stat news reporter Matthew Harper on the news that Madonna's Corona virus vaccine has produced antibodies and its phase one trial participants. Matthew. Thank you so much for putting this into context for us. Thanks so much for having me. Some breaking news this afternoon from Washington, the nation's top infectious disease expert, Dr Anthony Fauci, is pushing back after a scathing op ed from President Trump's trade advisor Peter Navarro. Navarro said. Quote Anthony Fauci has been wrong about everything I have interacted with him on in an interview with the Atlantic that's just out today found she calls the White House behavior bizarre. And says he found she isn't going anywhere. Let's bring in NPR national political correspondent Mara Liasson Mara tell us more about what he has been saying. Well, she gave an interview to the Atlantic. He called the efforts from the White House to discredit him bizarre and nonsense. And actually, he said they were going to ultimately backfire on the president and that the White House understood that And that's why they have disavowed thie op ed that Peter Navarro wrote attacking Fauci. He said that Peter Navarro was in a world by himself and I can tell you that there many people who work in the White House who would agree with him. Hey also said that he met with the chief of staff of the White House, Mark Meadows, who told him that the op ed by Navarro was a mistake and that Meadows himself didn't know about it. So those are just some of the things that factory saying But the thing is, we've just been reporting in the last few days about others in the Trump administration, who have also gone after watching including Admiral Jaguar, who's also on the task force that it seems like a pattern coming from the White House that they're going after. Anthony Fauci, who's saying things that they don't like? Well, this is the common thread in this White House kind of one hand, is working against the other hand. On the one hand, there seemed to be an organized concerted effort to undermine Fauci to explain all the kinds that found she was wrong. They've told given reporters kind of chapter and verse of all the Times found she was wrong..

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