Texas, Iraq, Catherine discussed on Commonwealth Club


Them. And learn more that increase understanding continues to push. The likelihood of rapid loss of Landes higher. Probabilities are getting higher the more that the more that we understand about those processes, even we're certainly conducting a global experiment for which we don't have any. Previous example to look back on we can look at paleo climate periods. Where? There's been warmer. There's been less ice on land. Or in some cases, no ice on land. Sea levels sea levels was much higher during those periods. The rate of change in terms of the forcing in terms of the increase in greenhouse gas concentrations was much slower than what we're conducting now. So we're we're observing. A once in a once in a lifetime experiment once in geologic. Lifetime experiment, we're observing in real time. And certainly the in terms of. Whether or not the Commonwealth club of California will continue to. Have its front door above sea level here in this beautiful new location? That remains to be seen. Let's go to our questions. Welcome to climate one. Hi, my name is Wayne climate advocate as opposed to know who's not climate advocate. Katherine climate emergency. We have maybe a decade or two to get off fossil fuels or we're gonna blow past climate tipping points. How do you talk about climate to your evangelical as if it's a real emergencies? If a kid is grabbing for a bottle of poison in about to drink, it, you wouldn't say, well, we should think about whether that's a good thing to do. We're not we're in an emergency. And we have a little time left to solve this problem. How do you talk about this is an emergency climate emergency? Thank you. Well, first of all, I I talked to a lot of people. It's not, you know, I talked to water managers and farmers and ranchers and the woman's club in the book club and the club. And what I've found is that when we go in saying, it's the end of the world as we know it. People. Tune radio. Because if it's the end of the world, if we have to change everything we know about within a fixed Ed line, why even bother so we did a global weirding episode on messing with fear versus hope and on one side. We're scientists we're not going to sugar coat it. We're not going to like pretend that things aren't bad. They are bad sea levels rising twice as fast now as it was twenty five years ago. We're seeing these studies coming out that each steady almost seems like it's worse than the one before. But at the same time fear is not going to motivate the long term sustained action, we need to fix this thing. Fear is an emotion that helps us run faster than the bear. Or as we learned in Canada run faster than the person beside you. There's only gonna get one person. That's not what we need to fix this. We don't need an apocalyptic vision of the future. That's just going to make us wanna climate Abedin pull the covers heads. I the colleague share with me. And this is in Texas that she couldn't even bring up the words climate change in your class because people would have panic attacks in her class that is not going to help us fix this problem. What we need is rational hope rational. And that we understand the magnitude of the problem that we have but hope in that we are motivated by the vision of a better future. And if you ask me, what's the biggest thing, we're missing right now. I would say we're missing a vision of a better future. I recently interviewed some psychologists up here. I agree with you on fear. But they say that just pushing it aside and pretending it's not there and having kind of fake hope are contrived hope is not authentic hope. So you've got to hold that fear, and then kind of work through it. And then you get to the real hope that really fuels you forward kind of bearing that fear doesn't faking it doesn't work. Our next question. Anti-gun thorough environment. Scientists here in the bay area. I Catherine I could not think of anyone more deserving of this award. Congratulations. I wanted to ask you we've all been at this for a long time climbing education, you have the credit to speak in places described that that would never want to hear from me. And I'm wondering whether you can talk about kind of change that you have seen in the more conservative audience is that you've talked to over the last ten years. And if if there's change was look like. That you've noticed. Yeah. So I've been in Texas now for over ten years, and I absolutely have witnessed change the changes is that people in organizations who would not give me the time of day ten years ago. Who would as they say as they say crossed the other side of the street to avoid me. Those people are now so concerned over the changes, they're seeing happening in the places where they live and the way that is affecting their livelihood and their local environment that they are calling me and asking me to come speak to groups which ten years ago the door would not just have been shut. It would have been triple loft with a big keep out you climate scientists on the door. So I've I've been to talk to agroup. So if you think even Jukka colleges conservative, you have not met an agroup in Texas. Groups are calling me now the oil and gas industry is calling people who own large amounts of land wanna know. Should we be selling? What are we supposed to be doing with this? So there is significant movement. And when people come to ask you, that's when the door is open. That's when the time has come to figure out. What do you have in common? What are the values? You can start with where can you go together because knocking on the door rarely yields positive constructive outcomes? But when that door is cracked open, and you're cautiously invited in by one person, and then everybody else in the room is giving Joe the evil eye because why did Joe invite this climate scientists pay you're in the room that's positive things can happen. And they absolutely are happening in Texas. And if they can happen in the west part of Texas, they can pretty much happen anywhere in the country. We shift this conversation to even we stopped today. We would be beyond potentially. Okay. So how can we switch the conversation where people still need to cut? But yes, we need to actually ginger near. We need to carbon sequestration carbon removal, whatever you wanna call it. Why is that not the clarion call? Let's get the carbon out of there. Let's put it out of the environment. Maybe in Iraq or somewhere else. Why isn't that the number one thing we're talking about? We don't have to be sending to drive your SUV. You can be offsetting that or putting rock or putting other sequestration methods, offsets, etc. Why isn't not the number one thing we talk about when it becomes less political because we're just another Bill we pay our offset for the month. Catherine's looking at me. Well, first of all, I would say people are absolutely starting to talk about it. And I think we need to be talking about it. But it's not like an indulgence where you pay for your sense, we have to do both. We don't have the luxury anymore of saying we can produce as much carbon as we want and just suck it back out. But I am personally very excited by the work of of organizations like the Swiss climb works. It's working with David Keith where they've actually sucked carbon the atmosphere and they've turned it into fuel. How amazing is that? Or they've turned it like you said into Iraq. Or again, there is a lot of regenerative agriculture techniques where you can put carbon into the soil where it's actually good for the soil, and we want it in the soil. So the answer is yes. But the answer is also yes to cutting carbon as soon as possible, the answer is we need pretty much everything on the table and with geo engineering specifically often people use it only refer to solar radiation management as opposed to all different types of geo engineering part of the challenge we've run into the scientific community is nobody wants to even pay for studies to figure out does. It work what are the side effects? So the thing I'm most afraid of is that some country that has the technical ability could do something really invasive to stave off climate change. It'd be like giving an experimental drug to the entire planet at the same time without knowing really what all the side effects are because people are too afraid to fund the scientists actually just research and study this we understand what do you think? Yeah. So I think. I mean, I've heard a lot of strong statements before the question Mark of the questions. And I I think I think I think a lot of the statements are stronger than the evidence on really on both in terms of the the implications of different levels of global warming and the potential side effects of geo engineering. I think if. So there's certainly a thresholds in the climate system. And Greg was saying earlier, you Steve Schneider say we don't we're not really going to know where those tipping points are until we've already passed them. And I think that's the science bears that out. And the lot of my work over the last two years has been on trying to understand the impacts of the twin one point five degrees in two degrees. Two degrees and the national commitments that put us more two point seven, right? And there's a lot of interesting nuance there. And we think we have to keep in mind that fossil fuels have really driven. The lifestyle that we all are gotten us into this room now, and there are billions of people on planet earth that don't have access to that. And that again, whether it's whether you take unethical ethical view or a practical view that there's a lot of momentum towards further energy use. And I think we don't have an alternative right now that could supply the global. The whole world the whole population with the energy that's necessary for human wellbeing. And so to me, the real challenge is how do we how do we ensure that the world has access to the to the energy resources that are necessary for for high quality human life never mind getting out of abject poverty. And how do we do that in a way that minimizes the impact on the climate system? Also mentioned we have entire podcast on geo engineering going carbon negative. We did a whole thing on carbon sequestration putting it in. Because look at our podcast for that. Let's go to the next question. Welcome. Hi, my name's Evan Heinsohn, the founder of climate dot careers. We strive to match job seekers with employment opportunities organizations working to address the causes and effects of climate change. Katherine you spoke on the importance of finding commonalities with climate deniers says a way of bringing them over or okay, you shake, Leslie. So go ahead. Down there. But you know, there's been a lot of excitement discussion around the concept of a green new deal deal as a way of to address both climate change in bolster our economy. It seems to me that employment and economic growth could be sort of a commonality where we can bridge the divide politically between folks who are agreeing with that climate change is real and we need to do something about it. And folks who are on the opposite side of that. What I would love to hear your thoughts on this. And. If that is the green new deal is a plausible solution. What are the sort of challenges that you see? We need to overcome. If we want to achieve implementing a solution. Like that. Thank you. Eight. So the reason why I was shaking my head is because and I'm glad you brought this up because this is really important again ten percent of the US population is dismissive, which means they will dismiss any and every piece of evidence you bring up about clean energy, though. They might actually be okay with nuclear some are clean energy about climate change about any type of data and facts. And so I try to spend as little time as I can with people who are dismissive because they just suck your energy, and they're never gonna change their mind about anything. But with people who are disengaged or doubtful or cautious. Absolutely. That's where we can make positive steps. And honestly, I don't care if they think climate is changing did human activities, if they agree that clean energy is the best possible thing for our future. Man is David care Belenkov. I'm Elliot people named Alaska where the gateway to the Arctic as a visitor here. I just wanted to acknowledge you Aloni people whose traditional territory were on and to. Point out. The fact that colonization is a root of the climate crisis and settlers acting on their own behalf..

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