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Is all been fine. It seems that nobody has any first hand. The knowledge there is no first-hand knowledge but in no case I've been heard in no case is that I have I been heard. I want to talk about next week. Take the president. Says he's not concerned at all yet. This will be historic. We have public televise impeachment hearings very often in this country and I'm wondering the White House views that heading into that look so there's a difference between the president and the White House on how they're viewing it. The White House is viewing it from sort of the the fact based practical practical we've seen hearings that had blown up on the Democrats before the Corey Lewandowski hearing didn't work out the way they wanted. Certainly the Robert Muller hearing didn't work out the way they wanted and the president is where both of those things but donald trump is is uniquely aware of that White House is the impact of television on people watching it and how they will take in the information and how a good witness can be compelling doing and I don't think he is thrilled with any of this. I don't think he's thrilled that he has to go through them in a number of people who've been in touch with him He is he. He's just sort of dreading all of this this. I think he tells himself this will be fine. He is trying to tell himself. This is just another political. Fight has to go through. But he knows the power of of televised hearings can be compelling pelling. Geoffrey you notice it was one thing he said yesterday and earlier today that you just showed that. I think you're going to hear a lot next week is I didn't talk to these as people I mean the the leadoff witness is investor. Taylor and as Taylor has acknowledged he did not have one on one conversation with with with President trump. And that. I think we'll be a major republican. Talking Point come Wednesday the Democrats in Congress our congressional team reporting on this tonight is apparently preparing and for these hearings at a level with which they haven't done before certainly more than the Muller hearings they're going to have counsel. Do the questioning here. It does seem Jeffrey. They're they're very aware of what Maggie describes describes as the TV moment that will be happening absolutely. And if you think back to I mean all the way back to Watergate you know. The Sam Ervin was the chairman of the committee. It's one of the defining moments of the nineteen seventies The one thousand nine hundred ninety eight Clinton hearings themselves weren't as dramatic. You didn't have John Dean and the or anyone equivalent but I mean this is going to be one of the things. Donald Trump's presidency is remembered for the fact that impeachment hearings took place and and these witnesses testified now. Does he get impeached. Does he get convicted. Does he get reelected. Beats the hell out of me. I don't know but this is going to be a historical moment home and this president's in one as Maggie says he's keenly aware of he knows. TV He probably watched those hearings for all we know knows what it was like. I mean he certainly watch over the Watergate hearings. I have no idea but I mean he but he's certainly watched the muller hearings. He certainly watched parts Lindau ski hearing I mean he he he will be paying attention to this right Maggie Jeffrey. Thank you very much for being with US tonight. Coming up more on the questions surrounding Mick Mulvaney and David Gergen who knows a lot about the realities inside a White House remember. uh-huh create an ad like this one visit pure winning dot com slash CNN. That's the end of the morning dragon experiment. Are you going to play first off. I'm always sleigh at Queen's secondly yes brick and mortar five all episodes premiering Sunday November tenth. Only on adult swim as we mentioned the top of the broadcast of White House. Chief of Staff is in charge of implementing White House policy the president's policy so what are the transcripts released Lisa of testimony from to White House. Aides who point to President Trump's acting chief of staff Mick Mulvaney as a focal point. They say he made a great deal of the maneuvering bring in the Ukraine affair. Few better to ask about all this David Gergen who has served in four white houses both Republican and Democrat. He is a CNN senior political analyst. Let's David thanks so much for being with us. Look generally speaking judge in your vast experience and I do mean that vast experience inside these different administrations to chiefs Lisa Staff. Freelance typically. Do they do things on their own. No no even the strongest chiefs of Staff. Don't and Mick mulvaney bovine is I think the weakest chief of staff and modern history. You know he's he's he's still acting both of his predecessors were fired. The president makes it clear on many occasions that he makes all the decisions everybody reports Dan. He doesn't really really doesn't matter. In a number vacancies occurring government because he is the government And so I think that Mick Mulvaney is in a situation where he he would never go outside his lane he would only he he would act at the Bass to the President even strong chiefs of staff go to the president with a big issue and Al.. Hey who had enormous power during the closing months of of the Nixon administration when the President essentially sort of off Keel and. Hey Guy Dolle things together. Yeah there he would still go to the president. Jim Baker. Who is I think the most successful chief of staff in modern history working for Ronald Reagan He would never go And Act independently of Reagan. He would always go to the boss. He would also explore things with other so and one more thing John and this decision Asian about holding back money was a big deal. That's why so many people like you know the the Bolton you know were in revolt against the whole Hennessy. Staff opposed this teams over the State Department opposed. The chief of staff is not GonNa make a decision absent presidential direction of such weight and and so controversial without taking it to the boss to start with and so I was thinking. Of course he he got the information Got The direction From the press. I just don't think there's any doubt that ultimately He did that and by the way if he didn't if he was rogue L. Player out there he'd be gone by so now he'd be the scapegoat about all of this. We wouldn't even be a mess all these hearing so. I'm not sure this was necessary. Or you think this was necessary to prove you. So you see this as definitive proof. Now that the president was involved was involved either directly or at least oversaw. What has has been described as a shakedown forcing the Ukrainian leader to investigate the binds in order to get a meeting or in order to get this military all signals point point to this went into the Oval Office? The president was deeply involved. There's no signal to the contrary. I will say this John Because I want to. I want to reinforce something Jeffrey. Free an argument. Jeffrey was making the Republicans cleverly. I think you have created a catch. Twenty two for the Democrats and that is they're arguing. Well the president. There's nothing in any of these people. that directly comes in the president. There's no evidence that the president ordered this and the same Republicans ineffective blocking from testifying three men who knows the truth. Who Know the full story? We've been denied and that is obviously vein. Obviously Bolton but obviously Giuliani as well and you know Democrats I think have to fight harder to get their testimony. I think Jeffrey was right. I don't understand the strategy there on about saying in well it'd be just rope it up. They ought to be raising. How so people WanNa just when when the final report comes out and the Republicans are you but you never proved it? You never proved it. They against there's only one reason we didn't have the full story and that is the key people wouldn't testify. So that's one argument here is that you don't have directly. Even though all fingers point in a certain direction the other argument that you've heard and I think you will hear again after all. This evidence is presented publicly that which has been presented behind closed. Doors is yes it happened. Yes there is the evidence of all this but it's not impeachable. I'm just wondering if you think that more evidence you have that it actually happened a certain way. If there's a point where that becomes an argument for it being impeachable. I do think that if you get the full story. It's going to have a thuggish kind of quality to at least one or two major players and it's going to reveal things about the White House. It sort of fit our darkest interpretations of what it's like like inside this team So that it's important to get a more graphic story. I thought you know one of the the Taylor testimony for example which was the most important testimony. We've heard so far. Had graphic quality to it. They really made us understand how it sort of ugly. This situation was and William Taylor will be the very first the public witness in the impeachment inquiry televised next Wednesday David Gergen. Thanks so much for being with us this evening. One last point one point. Yeah in one one of the reasons I think the Democrats. I've got to pay attention right now. Is there is some slippage in national support for an impeachment. It's it's small but it is contrary slightly above fifty percent below fifty percent. That is something I know. They are watching tonight. David Gergen thanks for being with us. Thank you John. We do have breaking breaking news Michael Bloomberg files for a twenty twenty Democratic primary. Does this mean he's definitely running on Saturday. November Ninth Jon Moxley Frizz Kenny Omega Kobe versus Chris Jericho for the ad w world world championship wrestling presents full gear by now or the our live Wednesdays on TNT alleged all the league rustling hits harder flies higher and Briggs all boundaries Christianity all wrestling a new League Wednesdays at at eight on TNT breaking.