Listen: Francis Fukuyama, Deb Mash Eck, Tiffany Wilson Worsely discussed on How Do We Fix It?
"Tiffany Wilson Worsely. What do you think of that? Jim. Well, I love her idea that we're what she calls a bold Americans. And that by being bold Americans. We can handle having somebody. We don't like in that White House are handle hearing ideas, we don't like, and we can come back strong. We don't have to be cowed and intimidated, I think the idea of living room conversations is to establish ground rules. I so that you have a little structure to build a difficult conversation. It's okay to talk to people. You don't agree with? I think we'd get hung up on trying to change people's minds and basically argue with them about about their beliefs. And and what we see in these discussions is shut up for minute. Listen and that when they do this. They find out that these people on the other side don't seem like such bad people, you might still think they're wrong. But you don't think there either. Vil? These discussions are about race. Which is a topic. We have not dealt with very much so far on how do we fix it? And for many people their racial identity, or their identity is an immigrant is held very deeply, and it has been front of mind since childhood, I think it's easy for people of privilege like us to urge others to be more rational, or maybe more open minded or or less tribal, but identity is very powerful. Yeah. It is such a tough subject and one that we're not necessarily best position to to be experts on. But I do recommend that listeners. Go back and listen to our interview with Francis Fukuyama who wrote this fascinating book about again, ity and identity politics, and he believes that we're actually sliding backwards towards. Making racial characteristics and other forms of dandy to central to our discussions who people are he thinks that's unhealthy. Everyone's an individual. They can form their own ideas, their background their histories part of who they are maybe part. They're very proud of. But it shouldn't define them. And he speaks as the son of Japanese Americans who were in turned during World War Two. That's well, I found that kind of amazing his discussion. I'm he's clearly someone from a minority background who doesn't feel limited or defined by his ethnicity at all. But one thing I want to get back to in this discussion is this idea of ground rules that you can't just jump into a difficult conversation about really polarizing topics with people without some idea what your goals, and that's what's actually happening here with both better angels and living room conversations. I think they're vital especially on college campuses as a way of promoting. Understanding an even viewpoint diversity. I see the word this group as being very much in harmony with with heterodox academy. We spoke with Deb mash Eck in earlier episode, I urge people to visit both on our website and on their websites. There are some of these ground rules that they use for conversations. And to me, the number one thing is are you able to respond to the idea the person is presenting without making reference to some moral category. That you wanna put the speaker in and we'll have links to both of those groups on our website for this show.."