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Or go right to our website for the comprehensive list on a global scale because any luck at all you actually might be traveling again soon speaking of traveling again soon I talked about this earlier in the show what we've seen so many countries announced that they're opening but it's like the old military parade will get them to say take two steps forward not you Jones well we're Jones because not everybody wants us to come with the surgeon coronavirus cases almost all across the country at least in twenty six states that are spiking R. and considering that the United States has banned the European Union countries from having their own citizens visit the United States the issue is more likely than not to basically put a ban on Americans flying to Europe right now right now there are many countries that do have a fourteen day quarantine should you go but this may go worse than that so stay tuned will certainly next week have an update on that but one of the other things or talk about about your rights as a passenger so many of you and you know because we talk about on the show so many of you have emailed me or called me because you booked a flight somewhere in Europe and you may have done it last November December January February needless to say you didn't get to go on that trip the airline canceled it and then it was like good luck getting a refund no we're not talking about U. S. airlines and we're not talking about airlines have flights either to the U. S. or from the US or even within the U. S. I'm talk about airlines it would go to a story between London and Barcelona that you know our European based airlines and some of them you heard of like Lufthansa of some of the maybe you haven't like Pegasus the bottom line is there is a European Union regulation allow which basically mirrors the regulation we have in this country from the DOT which allows you to get a full refund if that airline cancels first well very few of those airlines have participated and have abided by that rule and that brings me to my next yes he's the general secretary of opera he is the association of passenger rights advocates based in Brussels Patrick kibbles Patrick thank you for joining thank you for having me so you heard by introduction I'm sure you're hearing similar complaints over on your side of the pond yes absolutely where were flooded with complaints every day because airlines of course they're suffering they're struggling because of corona virus but so are passengers to and that they need their money back and they're not getting it back and our lines of course are making up all kinds of reasons not to pay out but can they be held liable or responsible to do the right thing but I absolutely I mean the day European regulation that which is easy to six one dealing with passenger rights era passenger I speak that it's there and it said it didn't force and so what what error lines have been doing and supported by member states in many cases it's just ignoring the European law and for instance they're offering vouchers which isn't at all an ideal situation to most travelers are not all of them are frequent travelers and a large number of travelers are also struggling financially someone lost their job and others have reduced income so they need their money back but our alliance they are not paying them back they're just giving them a voucher and acting in most cases like they don't have a right to be reimbursed they have to accept a voucher which is just not correct and the thing is even though the rules there nobody's like pounding on the door the airlines to say pay up well it robin is that it the European Commission sort of is there they they keep reiterating that the law is there and that it's that it's you can circumvent the law the problem is that certain member states are supporting the R. Allen's some of them have a large stake in the airline so it makes sense that they do it I mean it's not it's not okay that they do it but it makes sense from their point of view but the airlines they're basically given a carte Blanche because some of that member states are telling them or telling the the national enforcement bodies not to take action so the basic basically then do whatever they want without being penalized now the European Commission I sat on the fifteenth of may that this is no longer acceptable not that it was acceptable before but this time they're telling them if you do this there will be consequences and slowly we're seeing that the behavior of our lines is changing but they're still finding all kinds of tricks not to pay the passengers so it's a very dire situation and this is one area where you get involved in your organization for people listening to the show it makes it very difficult if they're based in the United States to get any of these airlines even to respond to them so my suggestion is Ben and and I'm not a lawyer and I don't play one on TV but if any of these airlines have sales agents in the United States or sales offices or if you book this ticket online through a U. S. an online travel agent or through another travel agent as a last resort you can go to small claims court and sue that seller because that's where the sale occurred and as long as the claim is not for over seven thousand five hundred dollars you're probably gonna prevail because most of the judges in small claims court right now or I should say many of them are probably trying to get their own refunds can't get a yeah of course now in your head it's not the case you have to go to the airline because they're in there ultimately liable because they carry out the flight the the travel agents they they can't be held liable for for the mistakes of the airline but the airlines are supposed to have to pay I mean we have we've accepted the fact that compensation which is not the same as reimbursement basis for the moment to be seen as an extraordinary circumstance because of covert nineteen and so we haven't been pushing or advising passengers to get their compensation and but we and we even told them to accept a voucher if they could and because we know our lines are struggling and nobody benefits from my from allies going bankrupt we don't want further market consolidation it won't be a good situation for African tumors so we we want them to survive or so we have been very lenient and understanding but the more you give them the more they have used that position to have and just basically cheap there are their customers and that's not the case and that's why we have stepped up our game a little bit and are now fighting there data to do and their the baby to its passengers are there certain countries that have gone out of their way just to protect the airlines in their fight against giving refunds yes I mean it's it's it's obviously the countries that have a stake in the airlines and the the the the the worst example in my and in my experience which is especially painful because of the country I'm from the Netherlands they have just pulled down for somebody not to do anything they said it B. R. line should be able to give vouchers the center for the longest time they even try to form a coalition than they did in the end of member states pushing the European Commission to to make it legal at least for a period of time fortunately the commission stood firm and they said no but what happened is that they the prime minister made a statement on television saying.

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