Amazon, Google, Spotify discussed on Recode Decode
To decoder. I'm neil patel editor. Chief of the verge and decoder is my show about big ideas and other problems this week. I'm talking to harass you. Gutierrez head of global affairs chief legal officer of spotify. I asked her to come under curtis week and help me understand what spotify and so many other app developers are so frustrated with apple. Proc- recently testified in front of congress about business practices. And he just wrote an op. Ed in the wall street journal calling apple a ruthless philosophy. But it's all part of a trend if you've been listening to decoder diverge just following tech news recently you probably know. There's a lot of government interest around the world in managing the size and power of big tech companies. A few weeks ago we had senator amy klobuchar on the show to talk about that hearing in congress and her proposed antitrust law reforms. They're ongoing antitrust lawsuits right now. From the department of justice the federal trade commission in various states again school facebook and amazon. There's a ton of regulatory pressure in europe with a new preceding apple and a long history of enforcements against google and facebook. And of course. There's a trial between epic games which makes fortnight and apple epochs suit apple nine months ago claiming that the iphone maker unfairly restricts competition for app distribution inept payments and requested sweeping remedies from the court including allowing other app stores on apple devices. That trial took three weeks that involve testimony from both apple. Ceo tim cook and epoch. Ceo tim sweeney and produced a mountain of internal emails and documents from both companies as evidence at the heart of it. All is one number thirty percent. That's the fi apple chargers app developers for inet purchases of anything digital to make this simple when you buy a physical hardcover book from amazon in the amazon app. For ten dollars you pay the entire ten dollars to amazon. But if you were able to buy a kindle book in the kindle app for ten dollars three of those taller would go to apple amazon. Doesn't wanna pay money. Which is why you cannot buy books in the kindle app on the iphone. It is a weird situation now. Epa claimed at all of this is anti-competitive. We had a trial. We're not expecting a decision from that trial for weeks. If not months but i wanted to understand what all of this legal maneuvering means. We've and how involving courts and politicians in the workings of our phones would actually make them better. There's some fuzziness there right. I don't think it's obvious to most people that having politicians redesign our phones is a good idea. So i really wanted to push her. Osceola sees the biggest problems of apple's behaviour what he would do to actually fix it and how all of that connects to having more interesting innovative and better products in our lives. Because if you can't make that case then we just moving money around. I also asked if he sees a connection between how he perceives apple and how musicians perceive spotify. They're both huge companies that most working creatives. Don't get to negotiate. With an spotify buying up big chunks of the podcasting ecosystem giving a dominant position in fast growing industry cross unsurprisingly push-back on these comparisons a range of from spotify loud and clear website that lays out. Exactly how how much pays artists around the world. But as all of these companies get bigger the dynamics supplant between platforms and creators feel eerily similar. Keep that in mind as you listen to this conversation. What does it even mean to have a market. If so many players don't.