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A managing behavioral health services and he's been involved in the training and development of something called harm reduction services in particular regarding tobacco and so it's always interesting to hear this because we hear things like vaping is safer that non smoking then we hear no it has more cancerous elements then smoking and you you just try to pay attention to the signs but we don't really know when you hear conflicting things Kevin may have the update for us and he's also paying attention to this new anti tobacco bill that's been approved in committee by it's McConnell and to McCain welcome to America trends thank you for being with us good to be here thank you he was well Kevin so how did you get started doing all this and paying attention what is basically is a sentiment on the things we just talked about save vaping versus cigarettes I guess well I didn't call reduction services for quite some years and of course you probably are aware of that harm reduction began with needle exchange and I don't want to do with all substances other than tobacco however I was working with and still am working with people with serious mental health problems as well as people who use other substances and became the lately where that this was really a much bigger issue then of course other drug and alcohol use almost half a million people every year die from tobacco related illnesses so I began to think about how do we actually begin to apply some reduction principles and ideas to this population particular given their vulnerability they tend to not smoke twice as much as the general population and they don't line up the conventional tobacco intervention smoking cessation strategies so I began to come away or beeping as a potential for this as well as other populations of people who are still smoking you or any any mention something about the safety issue and to be truthful you know the jury is still out no one is suggesting that beeping is state but a number of people including the United Kingdom the government of Switzerland New Zealand Canada the national association scientists engineers in medicine all indicated that they see that these products are much safer than smoking combustible tobacco and that they also have and have already demonstrated some potential to help people switch combustible tobacco use I think part of the issue and we know that well nicotine is definitely an addicting drugs all one people smoke and they are engaged in the ritual of smoking Malkovich beside her habit of nicotine or whatever were directed to with the vaping sort of a hand to mouth thing that you'd be here about in psychological circles and I know that that's sort of your your area you in fact help people you intervene do interventions for people serial serious mental illnesses and and getting off things like this the people last part of your question I was just giving a little bit of your background that you almost have to wonder besides being addicted to the elements is it a hand to mouth mental thing that we hear about sometimes in psychological circles you're the expert not me but I I just find it interesting absolutely absolutely we know that if you think about the the cigarette right and let's say someone is even a half a pack have to pack smoker per day and they actually you know it begins to structure people's days it's something to look forward to.

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