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Everyone and welcome to this week's episode of the not crazy podcast. I would like to introduce my co host Jackie Zimmerman who with major depression and anxiety disorders. And you know this guy gave Howard who lives with bipolar disorder. Jackie we've been friends for a while. Now we've been doing this show for several months and I decided that I want to risk all of that by talking about the one subject that causes more fights than any other subject known to man. And what would that be money? I want to talk about money. Money money money so in a recent poll. The three things that married couples fight about more than anything else are family religion and money and I would argue that money is at the top. Because nobody's taking people like onto the People's court or Judge Judy to sue over political and religious differences. Money is everywhere. If you talk to anybody literally just go grab a stranger on the street and be like. Hey you ever lost a friend over ten dollars. Almost everybody will have a story of a friendship. That just imploded over what we would consider a small amount of money. Money just creates an intense amount of anxiety in our society and the thing that I think is unique about money and anxiety is that it's something that I would assume everybody experiences not just people who are prone to anxiety not just people who live with mental illness but everyone has had some kind of issue with money that is given them anxiety. When I was younger I used to watch golf with my grandfather. And do these expose on the on the multi-millionaire golfers and they were interviewing one of them and they said. Hey when you have a PUTT and if you make the PUTT you win. One hundred thousand dollars and if you don't make it you lose one hundred thousand dollars. Does that caused you anxiety? Does that make you nervous? And the Guy said you know the most nervous I've ever been playing golf is when I bet another golfer a hundred dollars that I could make this. Putt and I didn't have one hundred dollars in my pocket. That really spoke to me because it wasn't the amount of money anymore. It was the awkwardness of discussing the money. Finding the money figuring out the money like this is what gave this guy anxiety and again. He's famous I don't know maybe he was just a cute story. He was telling bit. But that makes sense to me. You ever been in line and a dollar short. Like how embarrassing is that when you thinking that everybody in the store is like over on register five. There's a tall fat red head that does not have one dollar to pay for his groceries. I can feel that because if you've ever had your credit card declined for any reason your debit card and you WANNA justify it. I know there's money on there. That's so weird. I just used it like I just got paid. I swear I'm not a poor person race. There's this like panic where you want to justify. Why didn't work and my assumption is all of. This comes from the scarce any model right. We're all afraid of not having enough what happens when we don't have enough. So how do we have to work to get enough? What if we're working really hard and we still don't have enough and the anxiety around all of that of how much do you have? What happens when it's gone? I think is something that is underlying in our society and in everybody but amplified for those who live with any kind of illness because for me specifically when I worked at a big fat corporate job and I made all kinds of money all I thought to myself was. I'm staying here forever. So that way I make so much money that never have to worry about what happens if I actually can't work again because I will just bank so much money. I'll have so much I'll always pay my health insurance. Always have all of this stuff and spoiler alert. I don't work there anymore. It didn't make any money when I did work there. But when you have an illness whatever kind it is you're worried about money nitrous because of normal reasons but you're worried about like what if I can't work forever. What if I can't pay my health insurance? What if I can't afford to be healthy? That works its way around the Internet. That always says that. We're all three bad months away from being homeless. I don't know if that's true for all of us but that really spoke to me because it took about three bad months to really put me in a bad way where I started to need help on an interesting side note. None of us are three months away from being millionaire. So I think that we need to take that into account when we're determining how to like maybe structure our health insurance and things like that but but wrong wrong show. We'll just put that aside for a moment but think about this. The whole world is discussing being three bad months away from homelessness whether or not that holds up is really irrelevant. I think that does speak to the majority of people now. Let's apply that to people living with mental illness. People managing a lifelong and chronic disorder. Because I know that if I couldn't afford my medication if I couldn't afford therapy if I couldn't have afforded hospitalizations and on and on and on Gabe Howard would not be sitting here. That's just a hard fact. Yes I worked hard. Yes I have a loving family but you know what really saved me resources and that resource all boiled down two hundred dollar bills and that's sad. The catalyst for this was episode was from about a week ago. I sent Gabe text and basically I had a full blown anxiety meltdown because my husband had called me and said Oh my God our health insurance doubled on my last paycheck and I said wait. What do you mean it doubled? They didn't tell us that like they obviously would communicate that because that's what normal people think happens in the world But they didn't they just took it out of his check and it was doubled and I panicked and I have not an actual panic attack. I can't tell you how long but I felt it was the heart racing soul crushing. Can't breathe like Oh my God. What are we going to do because we are people right now? Who ARE LIVING PAYCHECK TO PAYCHECK. And that is even questionable. Because I don't know when my paychecks are coming in because I work for myself and I don't have regular paychecks and my husband took a pay cut a year ago to take the job. He's at now so all of this spiraling around my head and I'm like how are we going to do this? This is four hundred dollars. We didn't know we needed an. I could just work harder. But where am I going to find the client? Just you know. Anxiety spiral talk in your head and I reached out to Gabe because we were already talking to said. Hey I know you're telling me something important right now but I'm not really listening honestly because I'm worried about this health insurance thing and I realized in that moment how money is something that can cause high anxiety and within a split second like he sent me that text about our health insurance doubling and almost immediately. I was in a full-blown panic about it. There's so many directions that we can take this and that makes me excited. I love it when Jackie says. Oh my God ex and I'm like Oh my God. We can do Y. Z. Bat Symbol. So we might have to create multiple timelines. And let me ask you multiple questions about this because the first question that I'm going to ask you is if your health insurance would have doubled and you had a million dollars in the bank. Would it have bothered you at all me today? Thanks no but I also think that people who have a million dollars in the bank are really good about money and any sort of unexpected expense. That comes up. They're upset about it. Also I understand what you're saying because paying attention to our resources is a vital part of money management but a year ago. I was sitting on my couch at like two in the morning and it was storming and I felt a drop of water on my head and I looked up and the roof was leaking like leaking a lot and I saw all of this damage and I thought oh well. That's a bummer. And I went to bed. I just went to bed. That's it. There's nothing I can do about it. I couldn't stop the rain. I don't know how to fix a roof. I don't know how to fix a ceiling but the reason that I didn't freak out panic is because I had the money I flat out had the money. I knew that I could afford to fix it. There was nothing I could do and I slept well