Guys. Welcome to a very special conversation. Nations show about the Academy Awards but not just any Academy Awards are Academy Awards. were changing things up in the big picture this week. We've invited wisely from the New York Times we think for being here. Thanks for having me. Three Person Person Academy that makes us the Grammy Selection Committee. Hopefully less fraught less racist racist sexist and complete Taylor swift at Ed. Sheeran her part of my mom and I want the academy to tell the truth about who it is fun. Fact Taylor swift and Ed Sheeran had movie moments in the last twelve months. If you recall cheering yesterday Taylor Swift. Of course Miss Americana could forget. we're not going to be nominated for you said Miss Americana Either GonNa cats. That was yeah. That's very generous of you sir. I've locked that out we. We're not talking about that on this. PODCAST CAST now. We got the part right. Okay guys so every year the Oscars come around get very angry because they don't represent all the movies that we want to to be celebrated this year I would say it's been an unusually positive Oscar year in terms of nominations. However we got stuck in this conversation about why are there no female directors in the best director category? Why are there so few actors of color? Why are there so few uncut gems nominations are there so many things here we may? They disagree with that. We will discuss. I'm I'm your evolving. I'm evolving exactly the way to put it all evolving. Wesleyan a minute can you guys. Just give me coming some big picture feelings about where the Oscar nominating process is before we dig into our own awards well Without going into the Math Jeff on how the nomination determined at least in the best picture category whatever they did to make them less foreign needs to change because in addition just like I just wrote a piece for the paper Abou a complicated problem I have with. This year's show is the first time more. I'm I feel like the homogeneity among the best picture nominees just superficially is Kinda monotonous to me. What do you mean but up I mean basically what I mean. Is that lake. There are nine move. Eight movies about white people And like the the white experience yes there is a wide experience. PODCAST is often expanding on and in one from Korea or South Korea. And I I like all of these movies except for one and a half of them and so so. The thing that I am annoyed about is that there isn't it is not as though there's one movie that didn't get nominated that should have that also featured Richard people who are not white so my problem is more of an industry. Problem in the Oscars of course is a symptom of this larger thing. And so I'm Kinda just. I went back just to do some math on on on. How many movies among the nominees for best picture since they expanded ten were set the present and usually I mean the thing? That's thrilling about the best picture. Nominees every year is that you do get some really interesting story that gets told about the movie industry but also just the movies and something about this collection of movies as a collection as a class of films kind of bores me and but again like I like most of the nominees and so I don't know it's a weird place but they they have to change them. I think the man is part of this like even I don't like Hustler's that much but you this. This group of movies needs it. Needs it needs needs like a blindside. It needs a district District nine yeah. It needs a district night but you think that so. That's I think it's math don't you because don't what's the one film that would have resolved some of that feeling. Is that the farewell. Like what is it. I don't even see that's the weird thing also. I don't even care care what it was because I don't like any of the alternative. This is weird year for for the solution to this problem. There isn't one. There's no main waves. Waves would be a movie that would that would be more interesting but every year since they expanded ten has had just more interesting stuff. It I have a theory and it's not about math and I think your point about math is good and also your point that this is these are eight movies about white people is also important. uh-huh any everything we're about to say is not going to change that but I do just and it's not GonNa Change the industry and it's not GonNa Change. WHO GETS to make movies? Unfortunately but I do wonder if some of it is also like our expectations and our relationship to the nominees because we're used to being dissatisfied and we're used to findings something that to be mad about and since they've gotten to ten and especially in the last couple of years years. There are more movies that I'm excited about that are nominated for best picture. And even this year I would say they're five movies like jazzed about same same here and I'm not used to that and so I do think and and we're part of doing this podcast and talking about the Oscars is arguing talking about what was snubbed. And what the economy isn't representing. and I wonder if some of the boringness is just kind of. I don't know where to put all of that energy for what interesting that I hear that that particular aspect of this year's race though I think is an anomaly. I think there's two reasons for at one. We we just happen to get a couple of films from a couple of people who kind of always make big noisy special films. Martin Scorsese Quentin Tarantino. We got a couple of movies marriage story and the Irishman that probably would not have been financed by any other studio that got a lot more money than they would have gotten and so those movies got pushed up to the top. You know I know you guys probably not huge joker Fans but that's a highly unusual kind of movie to have been made in the way that it was position. Marketed the success that had had and also the parasite thing is. There's just no literally literally no precedent for a movie like this getting this much awareness appreciation potentialities to win The the fact that this is impossible right now is was utterly unpredictable. Even even in September I ran so I think accounting for this year in particular as a bellwether of any kind and is a little bit difficult long term. But the point that you're making one hundred percent right which is that you know. There's a certain kind of movie that still is always going to get made in Hollywood and there's a certain kind the movie that it's still really hard to get made that's movies by women's moving movies by filmmakers of color starring people of color about different kinds of experiences in the world. So that's not going to change. I think some of what we're we're GONNA do here accounts for that. I think some of the categories that were creating accounts for that. Yes I think. In general though the public perception of the Oscars is it's a little bit. Stodgy it's a little bit boring self-satisfied but also it doesn't really understand what's fun about movies no well that's part of I mean to the degree agree that there is a selection committee. It's People's self consciousness about their with. They want their tastes to be. Yes yeah and that to me is part of what I'm sensing about this group. The best picture nominees though I feel like I do feel like despite the fact that I actually could not subtract one of these movies or there's a ten slot at the tenth movie like what I mean. You could additive movie proud interesting lake. Ed Lee said in the president and at least about the thing that is seemingly the problem by gathering these movies together race Which member of the knives out family is each? That's a good game that somewhere. Oh I like that. We don't have to answer that right now but just trying to think of the Google anyway I but I but I also think that part of the problem. I think some of the things that I'm feeling is this. I mean I don't know it seems like a revenge against the way things seem to be going. Otherwise yes but you can't prove that a and I mean I'm arguing against my own myself right now but it's unprovable. It's just a feeling that I have a feels like every time they do these blind surveys of these academy members. There's always somebody who's like well. I don't think we have a diversity problem. I just think the movies that Star Wall you know other people uh-huh aren't as good as the ones right or even just that was nice. But it's not an Oscar film which covers all manner of sentence and that shows up in. Everyone knows that there is an Oscar film which there's been an Oscar film since like nineteen thirty nine like that's part of the problem. Yeah I don't know when it got so not. How did you no one team seventeen despite how much I love? It smells ker movie. It is twenty when I was fifteen. I did not think that was pejorative. In fact I thought that that was was meaning really really meaningful. My perception of it is changed or self conscious about it. That's an parasite actually wins. I'm going to feel really freaked out. Because does that mean that I'm basic because is the movie that I want to win also won the Academy Award. I just called aging. Yeah well I don't know I don't feel the way by moonlight. Yeah now more so feels like the exception and to me even though I mean in a weird way. Here's a good test of this of this question. The departed. I always think about the idea that departed is a best picture winner. You know what I mean. I think if the departed was directed by Guy Ritchie though it would have had no chance at the Oscars yes of course. The Scorsese. Only the Scorsese UNISOM did that but just looking at it. As a movie rate lake. That was the best picture of what was it. Two thousand six six. I just it just kind of. It's a funny thing. It's a funny thing that wasn't i. I wasn't the best movie of that year. Obviously are not obvious. It's funny that you bring that up. We actually just talked talked about that. Exact movie a couple of days ago show in that movie yeah. It's a totally fun and slightly. You need us. Yes Oh sure. Yeah what what other the way. I don't know actually actually. Actually what's going on with Matt Damon in that movie. Congratulations him okay. So if we were going to change James the telecast a little bit What what there was talk of this last year? About modifying the telecast. But I don't want to modify the telecast per se but I think that there's some categories that maybe we don't needed some categories and maybe we do need okay. I'm personally I just don't believe that. The shorts need to be in the Academy Awards No one watches them their unseen by the by the public at large. Are You mad at that. You want the short sustain gas. I do why I don't know but the idea. We will not a part of the rest of the conversation but is that really how it works. I mean I'm but you're talking to the wrong person and a win aware like I actually wish they had brought. I want to see the best bluegrass album winter. I WANNA see best. Okay I WANNA see best. Best Ja- best traditional jazz album. I WanNa see that person person win. You're in dangerous territory women. I personally would like there to be a nine hours. Oscar ceremony right. Amanda wants to get through this fairly quickly vision show. You're saying it's its own not work of art. But it's least its own entity that needs to have a start and a finish on a structure and momentum and energy we can't just like trot got out every single movie clip that Sean is like for the past seventy years and then let's talk about this cinematography. I'm and this one's like to the telestrator up with the old Oscar broadcast that were nobody really. There was no Internet for people to run to and complain. I mean it just ended when it ended and it was full of supporting clips. I mean for a lot of America. They didn't know who Pauline Collins was. They wanted to see like surely Valentine. What does that clip? This is good so you get a clip Pauline Collins Acting Shirley. Valentine know what you get is a weirdly spliced moment of an actor doing the most over the top contacts list part of a movie you have. If you don't know where Iran Iran remember. What Julia Roberts Best Actress Clip West Pretty woman? It was her singing kiss in the Jacuzzi.