By the quality of your relationships. And so a great way to create new relationships is by going on other people's podcasts. And so it's not just about getting in front of new audiences, which it is. If you can go on somebody else's podcast, they already have an active audience. You're tapping into that market for a lot less than a paid ad. So even if it's a small audience, there's still a lot of value in it. If it's an audience that might want to hire you someday. And so it's really about that visibility is helpful. However, the real relationship is actually with the host. It's about going on podcasts that make sense. It's about going on podcasts with hosts who have access to larger networks that can help move the needle in your business. And so, you know, it's always going to be about that networking. It's always going to be about strategic relationships. And it's always going to be about putting yourself in front of the right people and the right audiences. And so going on other people's podcasts is like fast track, like cheat code on how to get that done. Having your own podcast is also a great way to do it, but it's a lot longer of a of a haul. It's more expensive and it's a lot more work. Yeah, for sure. So talk to the listeners about go about getting booked on great podcasts for them and how to be a good podcast guest, if you would. Well, I would always recommend hiring an agency to get you booked, because when somebody else reaches out on your behalf, it always has a lot more weight than when you're reaching out yourself. But if you're not in a position to do that, you could certainly there's all kinds of communities that you can join that will match you up like, you know, pod matches, one refonic is another one. I need a podcast guest, I think is the name of it is a Facebook community with, you know, twenty five thousand plus members. So there's definitely places to go to get yourself booked. But I think the main thing is to remember, you know, what is your CTA? What is the point in going on these podcasts? And have you really refined it? And do you have a clear place to send people at the end of it and making sure you're not going on podcasts that are a waste of time or don't match up with the quality of your brand or especially in this time don't match up with your political or personal belief systems? You know, you have to kind of vet everything these days to make sure you don't represent yourself the wrong way. But getting, you know, anytime, you know, I booked musicians for almost 20 years and whenever I would do events, if I reached out to an artist and they'd say, oh, hit up my booking agent, I was I would always know that I'd have to pay more. And that's just the name of the game. When you have a booking agent, you get paid more and you get respected more. So if I reach out and I say, you know, I'm reaching out to get this guest on your podcast and this is what makes them great. This is what makes them different. This is why they're a good fit. That email is probably going to be read and taken a little bit more seriously than than somebody with a podcast. Yeah, I definitely I think that is a huge point. I know, like for my podcast, I get a good number of people who reach out to me directly and they are good. Most of them are valuable guests. But I also have those agencies that over the years I've developed relationships with. And so they know what a good guest looks like from my podcast. So they're careful about who they send my way. And you're, of course, more open to it because you're like, oh, it's that agency. Like, always send me good people, like send them on through. And so, you know, there you go. It's the relationship, you know, it's always about the relationships. Absolutely. Absolutely. OK, well, so then speaking of the relationship, this is something that I think a lot of people struggle with, and that is SEO optimized content, but still keeping it connective. So what advice do you have? Use AI. There's a really great tool. I can share the link with you. Cast a magic that can take your content and optimize it and write better SEO optimized titles for your content and pull the keywords and all that. SEO is just this deep, dark, black hole of despair where you're just trying to get this retention of the robots. Not to be too dystopian, but at the end of the day, it's like, pay attention to me, Mr. Google. I'm the prettiest website, whatever. But there's a lot of value there. And a podcast is actually an SEO machine if you get out of your own way. So like first example, everybody puts episode numbers in their podcasts. It's a deal killer. Searchability is very different than visibility and discoverability. So if you want your content to be searchable, which means it's people who have already discovered your content. So people say, well, I put numbers because I want them to go be able to find it easily. Well, they already found it once they can find it again. It's in chronological order. Your first goal should not be to make it more convenient for your podcast listeners to listen to an episode again, because that's not that probable or as beneficial as making your content discoverable. So take out the episode number and take out your name from the episode and only use heavy descriptive words.