Hilda, John, Patrick discussed on Theocast - Reformed Theology

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Pastors not strive to keep people in the fold for goodness triumph and preach christ them in love them in such a way that we would see them restored rather than taking pride in the fact that we throw them off So that was what last thing i. It's very much related to some of the stuff. We're talking about john. You're mentioning in counseling and weeping people and all this other stuff i i was shocked at how much the and it also serves the mission so it makes entire sense because we're all about this particular mission this particular brand. Here's how mars hilda's church there was so much like gross binding of the conscience that goes so far beyond scripture. It was wild and think example. After example of what. I would call Very significant pastoral. Overreach where it's a really an abuse of the pastoral office in an abuse of the pastoral authority that the lord has given us. It's like look we deal. As pastors in the areas of the preaching of christ in the administration of the sacraments and then we deal in the areas of sin and repentance period like for us to then go and tell people like oh. Well you know you're gonna you're going to do this. You know intense. Premarital you wanna get married okay well you're going to meet with a mentor couple and this and this and this may happen and you're gonna have to tell them everything about all of your failures sexually and the whole your whole life and then they're gonna assess it and they won't tell you you can't get married you know and it's like i mean that's one example or here's how you need to conduct yourself as husband and wife or know here's what it is like women you know. There are certain roles that they need to occupy and if they're working outside the home clearly you're in san. The males failed because he's not leading the right way. I mean it's just over and over and over and over again like all these sayings that the bible doesn't speak to definitively at all yet. We're telling people that they must do it this way. That is a man. That's a way to abuse people In really three clutter on on top of the gospel. And i think that occurred sadly from what i listened to anyway. Yeah that was a huge thing. The reformers push back on. Because i was what was going on wrestling that roam the view of the church's authority was it was magisterial authority like a king. It was authoritative because they set it in a crazy asked. Then were thing right to your point. Inquisition is in the whole battle. Deal right and then on the other side. You had the anna baptists. Right who essentially spiritual anarchists. Nobody has any authority right. It's just me in my willie with my bible. Whatever i feel like it says the former pushback on both right. There is authority within the church but it is ministerial authority. The church's authority as it faithfully minister the word of god and that authority stops where the word stops. We can't bind anybody's conscience beyond where the word of god us saw ali do this when i'm counselling people. I make a very clear distinction. What i'm telling them. Hey thus saith the lord you you have to do this this is an optional thing versus where i'm giving him wisdom of like. Hey this has been helpful for people. I've seen this be get. But i can't find your conscience to do that because i don't have. That authority are not financial advisers. Refried allergists wrote people. They come to me seeking wisdom probably grow weary of. They probably know that the thing. I'm going to save for the first two to three minutes. I'm going to be super clear about you. Know what this is and where my authority does and does not lie in this situation. It's like hey this is what you want me to talk to you as your brother in christ in your friend about this particular thing. I'm happy to do that. There may very well be other people in this church. That are way more able to speak to this than me. But i'm happy to talk to you about it. Happy to process it with you But i have no unique authority or wisdom to offer here. And i'm sure people are saying that again. You know but. I think to your point patrick on john. I know you do the same thing we do need to help. Our people know where our authority lies in where it does run Because we are not just this like unilaterally just kind of making decisions for everyone in our congregations about every single thing right. God help us. Good good friend of mine. Mike draws on a podcast recently said unfortunately congregants look at their pastors if they're competent in all things and we are not competent. All things we are called to be competent in few things and that's utah to write to properly administrate the word and shepherd the flock. That's what we're supposed to be competent. And if we're going to be put in that position and this is why james says not. Many of us should be teachers. You're probably not competent to do it So it's hard when you know. We do advice for a lot of things in even when it comes down to certain areas of counseling. I'd tell people. I'm like. I'm not competent to handle that outside. The realm of the illogical issue that is domestic issue. And you're going to have. That's a civil issue or whatever i said. Yeah my My last shot here. I know we're going over time. You're gonna is For someone who's been rocked by this. My encouragement to you is I to have experienced this. I have lost mentors I unfortunately a group at a pastor's home and in the fundamental baptist world. There's been a lot of guys in the news over the years. I've seen this. I've seen this happen. Unfortunately more often than not in the news. This loves this. They love to see the fall. And i being one that is experienced People that i love go through this. It is a good and helpful. Check to remind yourself of your motivation. So if you're a pastor you're listening to this encouragement to you is these are these are healthy moments from the lord for you to examine your own motivation and ask yourself what who. How am. I being held accountable is can. Someone called me on the carpet. Who who can confront me. If i'm being arrogant and prideful and out of control and i tell my congregants all of our new members class the reason why i have you read. The confession agree to it before you join. Our congregation is that you're going to hold me accountable to this confession. And i'm going to hold you accountable to in protects both of us and This is a historical document. That's been handed down by the churches and affirmed by thousands and hundreds of people. And i think we should pay attention to those kinds of things. Now listen not every confessional. Church holds the priority of a plurality of elders and a confession you can walk into a confessional church and that you're absolutely failure if they don't see the history and the importance of what is there which justin means. We need to do a church Podcast soon which we have scheduled on confessional. Ism which are. Maybe we'll bring patrick in for that one as well. Yeah maybe at one last shot for me to. I'm sorry i'm just not wearing your down. You hit your quota. I don't. I don't wanna leave this regular without saying this like we ought not listened to a podcast like this just assuming that we had altogether and that we have the moral high on and that we have the answer to every problem that ails us. That is not a healthy posture. We ought to listen to it with humility with. We oughta grieve when we hear things like this. We should weep with those who have been hurt by this And yeah we should. We should pray. Frankly for the grace of god that he would keep us from error and from wounding other people So we don't wanna come in with that kind of condescending mindset of well if they would have just understood this this this and this clearly. This wouldn't have happened and we've got it all figured out so this ain't gonna happen here. That's we need to galatian six one right. The second part of that verse is that we ought to keep watch on ourselves. You know busby to fall. Let me point just and i. I sent this to all of my leaders and elders and training and said you guys need to listen to this because we need to make sure that we don't fall into the same trap. Amen role as as i'll say this before we go. But as paul says These old testament failures were given as an example that you two may not fall in them. I think it's helpful to see the failures others and say hey. I think we need to pay attention to the the frailty of the flesh is real and and don't harden your heart. Yeah that's and just remember. Just art the tendencies of our flesh name of wanting to look at the other people's failures to feel validated. Her indicated self justified and that is so prevalent in our culture in the church. Outside of the church. This is this is what social media exists for. It seems like times is to look at everybody else's failures and fallings so that we can say it's not me we're going to move over to the ramana podcast We're gonna be talking over there multiple things. But how does the church respond to things like this. Do we have responsibilities to go after something. Like a mark driscoll origins mcdonald. How do shepherds do we shepherd our own congregation. What if you find yourself in a church where it is. More of a dictatorship How do you handle that as well. These are what we call a little bit more intimate and what would call teen conversation. Super from onda are those who have partnered with us to spread the message of confessional. Theology reformed theology not only to strengthen our own hearts in our own communities but to really build up the local church. This is really what the designers ministry is four. If you'd like to learn more about it you can go to dot org. And that's where we have our our podcast end local and online groups to meet for the sake of edification that we might build each other up and the church so participate in. That would love to have you there. Patrick walks could have you here. We look forward to having you back george as well as jimmy. Jimmy dykes back here in a few weeks as he gets up and going these to our new home what do you call it. Regular contributors all right. We'll see you guys..

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