United States, China and Trump discussed on Monocle 24: The Big Interview


A liberal democratic model, especially because we're ripping liberal democratic model apart kind of by the day right now, we'll come to that a minute while we're talking about and showing and she in particular you again in the book, and this is something you've talked about before the revival of the cult of personality. If you like in Beijing, this sort of Maoist tendency bit about you'll reading if Y that's expedient for Xi Jinping to to follow that course now, I think for twenty five years, a single thing that the west has believed that has really gotten wrong is that as China became wealthier and moved from. A state based fixed asset investment model to a consumer driven economy that they were gonna need to politically reform as a system, or they would fail to become more like us, the US the UK, the west, that's wrong. It's just wrong. And she's paying really gets that that state capitalism Thawra -tarian is is something that they can double down on and for the foreseeable future, it is a workable system. And indeed the average person in China today believes in the Chinese stream, even though they did not have any opportunity to vote for or against Uson pain. While the average American does not believe that the American dream applies to them or to their kids, and that is a horrible thing to admit. I think that if you were to ask me today, which political system is in greater need of structural reform, the United States, China, I would have to argue to you that it's. The debate and even five years ago, if I said that you'd say I was Chomsky or something like that, right? And, and it's horrifying to me to say that I don't want to say that the Chinese system might actually prevail. I don't wanna live in a world like that, but I have to recognize that she should pink does recognize it, and he is using his consolidation of Power to build up the communist party, not reform it and to build up the legitimacy of Chinese political thority, both at home and abroad, essentially idea of recognizing reality facing some tough truths and that sort of pundits you'll put auspices. Then the failure of globalism. One of the things that really strikes me is exactly something you picked up on a moment ago, something raw, the sad about a lot of the progress that you chose or will progress over regression to do with particular models. The sense that the American. Dream, it's not a given. It might not even exist might not even be possible anymore. Is there a sort of a balance of raw, the sorrow, full accepting of facts of the lessons of recent history that has to go with objective analysis that you do? Number of times, I was telling the pages it was, I felt like it was documenting something that was lost my approval, the problem, it's very personal book for me this. I mean, the book isn't about me, but in in the opening of the book, I do talk about my background a little bit just in the preface because it's why I wrote the book. I mean, I grew up in the project, so public housing in the United States. And there were no capitalists where I grew up because no one had capital, right? I'm busy people that just wanted jobs just want opportunities for the kids. And I know the my, my mother passed a couple of decades ago. But if she were around today, she would not have voted for Hillary or for Bush. She would've voted for any outsider that Trump would have been Trump. My brother did vote for Trump this last election. And it's not because I'm racist, it's because my brother believes that for decades you have had members of the establishment that just have been lying to an not caring about the average American because the United States today is by far the wealthiest major economy in the world. You look, we are the world's largest producer food. We are about to surpass the Saudis as the world's largest oil producer. We are the world's biggest technology superpower and so many areas, including AI, at least for now, these are big deals and we also are enjoying peace within our borders, right? And yet we have chosen to be unwilling and or incapable of taking that extraordinary wealth dividend and providing opportunities for people that are being left behind, and it's not just about economics. It's also about security. We have sent young men and women not. From the wealthy parts of society, but from the poorest, we've sent them to wars. Many of them have come back dead. Many of them come back broken. We've not taken care of them. We've not treated them as heroes. We keep doing it with our allies by the way who are also not happy about this right there populations. We've allowed in large numbers of immigrants which is certainly a policy that I've supported. But if you don't support the people that are at home, I, there's going to be much more backlash and there has been in the US and now on top of all this, we have technology which is driving people apart. It's it's unraveling the fabric of liberal democracy technologies, a wonderful thing in terms of economic growth. It is a horribly talks thing in terms of liberal democracy, especially when it's on regulated and you put all those things together. And yeah, you're damn right. We lost something. Remember this book is not called the failure of globalization. Globalization, right? Has brought enormous wealth to the world. It's the failure of globalism, which is not an economic process. It's a political ideology. An ideology that has been held by. People like me and you it monocle and others who have said, we're all one people, and if we open borders to goods and

Coming up next