Robert Menzies, Menzies, Menzies Australia discussed on Between The Lines


John Curtin bench shiftily enough, a coal will yell. Look. It's it is quite extraordinary. This is a part of politics that is long gone. I think Menzies was essentially an honorable and decent person who believes in the dignity of of public law and public service, and he had genuine friendships across the political divide in very rare families extrordinary letter that he'd written to join Kurt and a week before he died on and forty five. He was the launch Menzies opposition later, and he said look take all the time you need to rest relax thicket back going for holiday and worry about politics been chiefly. And I who was he's treasurer I looking off to things so don't worry. And that's a remarkable thing in in politics to have that they're in the middle of World War Two. As well. And yet, you probably didn't know that states relationship at the time. This is all behind the saints. Correct. Yeah. That's right. I mean knife four politics hard as any contemporary politician does, but they had a genuine friendship in. These interviews men's these talks about at the end of the digest simply having a drink or a Cup of tea with curtain or shiftily at the end of the day and just talking about politics, but often just talking about politics, and it was a genuine fringe, and he had a pretty good relationship with Colo you nodded in the contempt for Gough Whitlam rot. That's right. The funny thing is they both didn't vote for their party's in nine hundred seventy two fascinating. So call will who was leader of the labor party from sixty one to sixty seven did not vote for labour and seventy two Gough Whitlam and Menzies did not vote for McMahon in seventy two. That's right. And they can fought it to each other that I could not stay in the political parties if that ninety seventy two election, and in fact, go good evidence to suggest that Menzies did not vote liberally nine hundred sixty nine when Joan Gordon was wild or non and seventy four when Billy Snedden was liberal. There's at least three elections where he lift the fall. But he certainly came back for Malcolm phrases, nineteen seventy five election based on your research. Do you think the Menzies was a conservative liberal or centrist? This is a question. I get wherever I go. Look, it's difficult to apply Menzies belief in politics politics today in a contemporary context. I argue in the book that hey promoted liberalism within a conservative economic social policy framework. I mean, that's what he did. But certainly conservative in he's respect for institutions. He's fondness for the monarchy. He's belief in big power alliances is love of Westminster parliamentary democracy in the British legal tradition. But he did try to push the envelope on those liberalism questions. And I think we need to think about the context which liberal parties formed in the middle of the second World War. There was a question about increasing state power lives plans for nationalization extending rationing and wartime controls after the war. So so liberal parties fall. In this in this political cauldron where they were very shop political divides between socialism, and essentially liberalism, and he always himself as a liberal, and that's the why a dentist philosophically, but he did it within a conservative prime and historical context as you size important different eras, but he would have been aghast. At sei, John how it support for tariff cuts and work choices. Correct. Absolutely. Look, I think what we need to. Remember is the economy remind family shackled to very tightly regulated product and capital markets during the main zero there was rarely a budget surplus. The top marginal tax rate was sixty cents in the Dollah, Menzies Australia is different ustralia. It's not the Estrela of today and really one of the K messages of the book, Tom. He's policy legacy doesn't give us much. God's foot today. But how we practice the autumn. Silence of politics does urine Arendt's between the lines. This is Tom Switzer with Troy Brampton. He's the author of a new bog Raphy on Robert Menzies which was recently launched by the federal treasurer, Josh fraud book who also happen. Is to be the member four of young. That's right now in your book. You highlight means he's achievements financial assistance to non government schools that struck a below against sectarianism significant investment in universities colleges. The US alliance developing camera as the national capital yetis legacy is disputed. Let's he pull Keating in parliament in nineteen ninety two. The story of a looking. Wherever rate split from the system where we have the Xenophon is running around about Britain and bootstraps why not all Khosro cringe on the mandate which held us back for nearly generation. Prime minister Paul Keating, slamming the Menzies legacy that was annoying Noni to now let's get John Howard's response to katie's attack. He's held with me a few years ago. Well, I heard those remarks before. Somebody wants city would say that wouldn't be held us back. I will high minus shipping. Nodding forty nine was forty nine percent by not in seventy. It was close to seventy percent the nodding. Fifties was the first decade of the twentieth century in which ordinary a share of the good life. Now, if that's holding you back if that putting able gently to sleep, well, I'm all for hauling paper bag and putting them gently to sleep John. How'd with may a few years ago on this program now Troy Brampton who's wrought about the Menzies legacy catering, Ohio. It will look I'm going to disappoint. You Thome inside that I think that Beith Ron and wrong. Look, this is what makes such a compelling biographical subject. Is that you know, he continues to arouse strong emotions for some people. He's the personification of statesmanship in the twentieth century for others, stuffy at Wardi and figure out of chain with the emerging strata in the nineteen fifties and sixties the truth is that he's more substantial than he's critics lay out, but he has more full. It's than he's at Moore's except so yes, he got a lot of things rot. But there are a lot of things that we've lift in the poss and in the book, there are some quad jarring comments from Menzies on things locked Australia policy on average people on a pot in South Africa things like that that, you know, a really out of place in Estrella today. Well, one thing that means he's did get rot was the manner of his retirement. He did defy pals doctrine that all political Crees invalid. This is the Sydney Morning Herald following these resignation in all his long Ryan he has never enjoyed greater domination ovaries party. His government has never seemed more secure. He's health and energy are amazingly good for man of seventy one. He's mind is shop as ever no one can debt that if he wished he could remain in power for minis yet and fought at least one more election with success in the herald concluded his retirement is a model for other politicians both in Australia and abroad, you look at it wasn't exemplary departure from the prime ministership. He's still the prime minister delay. Under their own steam, you know in the more that fifty years, but I do think he probably stayed too long. I think it would have been better for him to leave perhaps before the non aged sixty three election. He would've voided the tragedy in Vietnam. They would have been list questions about commitment to things that were changing the live apart changed its position on the water strategy policy, for example, and it's interesting that when Harold Holt became prime minister, the liberal government move quite quickly in areas of policy, also, so they changed the water strider policy. They brought and the referendum on indigenous Australian, so so they recognize there was a Nate to China. Yes. The Sydney Morning Herald also reflects that of thinking when it argued quote, the Menzies period was not an era of political or intellectual excitement, ideas were not welcomed to bite was not encouraged intellectuals where frowned upon snubbed. It's time for China now fees ago on this program. Troy asked Hinson Robert Menzies daughter for her thoughts on the academic lifts. The other and what is an intellectual if he wasn't an intellectual he had Betty intellect and most people, I know, and this expression, intellectual more exactly does it mean. I talking about academics. Good. Yes. He did not always admire academics because they were academic. And they did not always understand the practical consequences of what they were suggesting, and he was a practical person Henderson on the academic lifts critique of her father, Robert Menzies yellow gothic. I think that that is a fair criticism got an endorsement for the book from Clive James who pointed out, the Robert Menzies government gave a vast generation of stralia, essentially free university education with scholarships and dramatically expanded the number of universities and resources going to them. So he gave them their education, and then they use the rest of their lives to denigrate him. So I think Menzies is on misunderstood by a lot of stray liens. He didn't get everything wrought. Something's he got wrong. I mean, there's a range of things. That he did that might these country better than it was will Menzies one set of the IB see quite I've never been persona grata with the IBC nor the IB with me. So it's great to have his boggled for on. The public broke us. Troy, great to have you on between the lines. Thanks for having me. Tom joy Bramson. He's author of Robert Menzies the out of politics that's just out by scribe. And we'll put a link on our website urine are in. Before

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