Listen: Fraud, Brooklyn, Toronto discussed on Call Your Girlfriend
"Hi ans- kidman hello hello. How's it going. You know i'm over here. It's kinda kind of warm podcasting in my underwear. You know work from home feelings. How are you. I am watching a storm roll through brooklyn right now and it is quite right in tens. It looks beautiful but also i'm really happy to be inside from afar. It seems like it has been storming in brooklyn all summer or maybe i just hear about it. I feel like august town where it doesn't rain. I think that like summer showers or like much more common than we like every summer. Everybody pretends that it doesn't rain all in august rain all the time and it feels great because it cuts through the heat. I love it. Oh my god it is true. I have to say that the thunder storm as as heat relief is one thing. I really miss about living in the mid west like a really good thunderstorm arctic. You mean in kansas city. I'm i'm recalling all of our midwest. City names perfect lead in to remind everyone that we're going on tour the one day. We'll be really good at transitions sometime. We should play a game at our live. Show where people throw out a topic and we have to artfully transition to it around like whatever we've been talking good. That's so good podcast mad libs. I'm into it. It seems terrifying but anyway that will not be happening on this fall tour. I'm i'm pretty sure where we will be going to some excellent cities toronto detroit denver austin and houston. I will also be going to toronto so let's let's talk about it. Let's talk about the fact that i think there are tickets left in all of these cities cities so we would love to see there and the schedule with the exact dates which are all in late september or early october. Is that call your girlfriend dot. Com slash tour sure. We also have some new merge in the c. y. G. shop <hes> some of it has already sold out and is getting restocked. It turns out <hes> you know. The crowd loves the dad dad hat so that's coming back soon but if you would like to buy some c._y._p. Merged you can go to shop c. y. Dot com slash. Mom hat dad mom. Had we doubt the actual term for this kind of they're. They're called data how did that. How did that come about. I wait hold on. Maybe maybe i'm lying. Maybe i am like fully holy lying so let's ask the global hive google yeah the call dad hats and data caps sorry that i made it into a gender binary situation. A friend of the podcast mercedes has a has a hat in the style that says fun mom on it which is great. Oh my god her us oh grant but also i just like sorry i do not blaming you personally for the for the dad hat phrase but i'm like is this not just like a baseball cap like a hat. I don't know listen as someone who's head is too big league for all sorts of hats and does not participate in the economy. This is just an overall sore point for me. Do you participate in the rap visor economy because i feel like that is a winner enter for heads of all sizes so i definitely have adviser that friend of the podcast amanda got me and when we went to hawaii and it says beach please <hes> it was great eight. That's maybe the best accessory i own. My hat is really too big. It's like my head and then you add hair. It's it's like. I don't mean like oh. I got to loosen up. The tabs like there is no tab that fits my head setting so i feel like maybe i just have to go into a hat store and just like talk doc someone about this. Wow yeah i mean 'cause i. That's normally what i what i think of as a really good solution for heads that are not served by the current hat economy yeah. Some of us have big heads but you know what we're okay with it. My big head for all of my big brain listen. I was just about to say it's because your brain is so so big. That's all oh my gosh okay. Please come see us on tour. Feel free to buy some merger. If you want there is also we'll be like dedicated c. y. Exclusive occlusive merge on tour so you know it all fits together. All these opportunities come while while while okay what are we talking about today and friedman. Today's conversation position is one that i think is maybe a little overdue on in the past. We've talked about various types of harassment and recources for that harassment but today we're taking kind of a new angle on things we're talking about like online invasions of privacy of all kinds specifically specifically revenge porn and online abuse what is revenge porn. Revenge porn is basically when somebody uses or distributes sexually explicit images of you without your consent for example. Let's say you are <hes> in an intimate relationship with someone or you send a nude a new of yourself to someone because you wanted to do it and then <hes> and that same image is used as a form of punishment or as a form of humiliation later in a way that you didn't consent you yeah that would be an invasion of your privacy. We're not talking about a stellar album by cardi b. We're talking about like an act that you should have have some legal recourse over and so like this is where like we talk all the time about how much we love a lawyer and people who are using more structural mechanisms to address bad behavior like this for a lot of the early history of camera functionality cell phones. People took very much victim blaming attitude of like oh. If a photo of of you exists out in the world in context you don't want it to exist in public when you need it to be private. If it is anywhere that you did not consent to that is sort of your fault because you took a sexy photo and i which is the thing that we don't say to people when it comes to like financial privacy or we don't say to you when it comes to medical privacy right but like when it comes to sexual privacy chrissy somehow we find a way to blame victims right. We're not like you opened a credit card. It's your fault that someone like charged a bunch of packages. Is that fedex like which is something that happened to me recently. No one was like shame on you for alex shame on you for owning a credit card. I can't believe this kind of fraud has just happened to you right exactly and so it is really interesting to sort of think about this in the context of any other violation deletion or fraud on one hand but on the other hand it's like it is very different right because like while the person who stole my credit card. Just you know wanted wanted money right like this is often used as like i don't know like a much more personal and if areas form of attack it is not just i mean it's about humiliating you know what the like what like fief has when they like when they use your credit card or like buy shoes on which should make us more sympathetic to someone who is having some images of themself used without consent in this way right like not less jamaica's more like oh my god. What do we do about this problem. I mean i hear you but that's also that's not how patriarchy amazon janie work you know and i also think that part of it too is that we don't have have a healthy attitude towards sex and sexuality and so much of these conversations are cloaked in shame right. You might feel really humiliated and embarrassed if you are involved evolved like some sort of like big financial fraud scheme which does happen to a lot of people people feel stupid or they feel more. They feel like there's a lot of shame about talking about but i think when it comes to this kind of very intimate form of abuse there is a different kind of shame that like shapes up because now you we'll have to talk to a lot of people including law enforcement about you know your body and your nudity and just things that are really intimate to you and <hes> you know and again like we just don't live in a society. That makes a normal thing to talk about so instead of feeling like you were violated. You can also leave feeling like you had a hand in in the humiliation that you're experiencing right. I've been really interested to see. I'm a fan of publication called salty which i love and recommend commend and will link to in the show notes salty world dot net and i noticed article there recently about copywriting your nudes which is like one one and way to ensure that you have a better toehold if you want legal recourse to fight someone using these without your consent and i was just like it was very much mind blowing you to think about that and i know this is not like a brand new thing that this publication has pioneered but it was like it's a step by step. Here's how you actually pursue a copyright for photos of if you're is that you want to remain private and it blew my mind yeah. I mean it's really interesting. When i was researching doing this article i i found this like staff that actually eighty percent of revenge ange porn photos which means that like you're the author of your own selfie essentially which is how you can use copyright to help you. Also the copyright office is weirdly early like getting hip to this so i would not say that the government is encouraging it but they're definitely tell you that. This is one of the only ways that they can help you. You know and i also think that there should be like no shame like everyone's. Everyone's nudes are fire. If you're news are you should be proud of them and you know taking ownership of that and giving the government a little bit of money to copyright your news like i'm down the yeah i mean and that's a good point. This article makes clear that like a registration fee submit them is between thirty five and fifty five dollars depending ending on the type of photos which i'm like that is not cheap right like it is definitely not cheap not cheap but if someone is infringing your copyright you can get up to one hundred and fifty thousand one dollars per photos so i'm not saying that's gonna make up before the harm that you have incurred but about thirty five dollars going to pay for itself. Can i also just make a side. I know when i when i think about the selfie in the light of intellectual property which is essentially like you're the author of your own photo in which you feel good good and sexy and possibly nude. I really feel very positively about the selfie in general right and i really think a lot about how this is not a new idea either. We've been talking about the self self authors in particular for quite some time but i really loved the reminder of guess what like this is not just a thing you made for someone else. It is like a way of creating a narrative for the world about yourself in your own body and i think that also really cuts to the core of why it is is such a violation when someone uses that image specifically to harm you or humiliate you yeah you know and also i think that it's just the copyright aspect of it is so interesting to me too because copyright is all about like you know what has creative value right and so <hes> if you look at the current laws they actually explicitly allow for pornographic or obscene material of the government would call it and basically like anybody over eighteen can register you know like the what kind of material but when i think about you know in the sense of like well your photos and your property do have creative value. This is the way that people consume your awards and you should feel proud about them. I feel proud about mine so it's great. None of this obviously is legal advice so so <hes> which is my favorite thing that my lawyer friends tell me whenever i ask for legal advice. You know where i'm like. Hey i just watched the nephew. Can you do and they're like. This is is not legal advice. I mean this is not a legal advice podcast. We're just two women who loved to talk about the law right and we love the copyright office. We go <hes> but i did talk to an expert kari goldberg who's an attorney who specializes in sexual privacy violations particularly revenge porn and online abuse. She's is the author of nobody's victim. Fighting psychos stalkers purves and trolls. Her book is out now wherever you buy books and i have to say it was a very illuminating donating read for me.."