Andy Pettitte, Roger Clemens, Tom Seaver discussed on Joe & Evan
Hi, Joe, Joe. Hi, guys. How are you? Good. Hey, Bernie Williams, he a better player than Harold Baines. Barney and. On the kangaroo. Hey, I put Bernie and Joe I think it's very possible that Bernie Williams getting the hall. The report out what I'm saying. We know what you're saying that we know and this has been going on for a long time where guys who are friends of friends get in Bill Mazeroski got him because reason no question. Phil Rizzuto got him because he was lobbied invite Ted Williams, right so years. So your point is, hey, someday, Don Mattingly may get in on the veterans committee, and he was on that. Ballot. Were Bernie Williams may gain or Andy Pettitte vague Evan my answer to you will be no one is off limits because we just saw Harold Baines. Smith, get no doubt. So thirty years from now when Brian Kenny is on the committee and Bobby Bray who is in the hall of fame. I will not be surprised. I will not be surprised again. Rankin. He May Day. Let's go to Derrick in Staten Island. Derek, our you. Hey, Joe and Evan. I want to practice. This by saying, I agree with you to a certain extent. But I have to disagree with you on on the envy paddock thing. Even though I agree that I don't think he's all famous. I don't think most Saul either. But you made a couple of statements that I think it's totally inaccurate number one. Jack Morris wasn't close to the basket during the eighties dates, Mike, Scott Orel Hershiser Roger Clemens off Derrick Derrick, Derrick. I've said let me just clarify. I look at numbers with him. Because I didn't see him pitch. Right. Mitt that. And I know that there's a different appreciation that you get for a player when you watch them. I don't think Moore's famous. I have heard as explanations for why he's a hall of fame wrong. And why can't look at the numbers about how good he was in the eighties. So I am not claiming he's the best pitcher of any founding was best picture the eighties. But he was again, it's it's the wins. He had I know you don't wanna put a big deal on wins. But thirty years ago. And the fact that he was did we did in the playoffs had some huge playoff moments for three different teams. Now, could I make my point real quick you let me go. Yes. Look, I I understand that and Evans, right. His postseason numbers were very comparable who was playoff numbers. Now had a few clunkers in the postseason Cleveland. Anaheim arizona. Joe Torry routinely with all the pictures that the Yankees had in those late nineties repeat routinely pitched this guy in game two, and he always did it because of the Yankees lost game one. He wanted to right the ship and game to all right? This guy's outpitched. John Smoltz in the playoffs. Now, I'm not advocating that he's a hall of Famer, but you guys were comparing him to Mike Mussina, and you asked a couple of calls if you think he's better than Mike Mussina. I'm a Yankee fan. It'd be better than Mike Mussina. I don't care what the numbers say Corey had more faith. And you know, what I'm in to partially agree with you hear these two very different questions. There's who's the better pitcher? And hey, Joe, I'm giving you the decision to start in a game. It's a different day yesterday. Big game. I'd rather have Andy Pettitte. That's me. Okay. No. I I actually agree with you. But that's a different question. Right. Cliff Lee put together some incredible postseasons, right? If I asked you to you rather start cliff Lee or name the hall of fame. Greg maddux. You may say cliff Lee, Greg Maddox was clearly the better paper now. So I think those are separate questions when you say who do you trust in a bigger game? And who is the better pitcher who you trust in a big game is very different. My dad always used to tell me is the biggest Seaver fan. Boy. Tom Seaver wasn't great in big spots. Now that doesn't mean he's not a first bowel. Right. The greatest of all. Time. But again that always sticks out to me, which Seaver was losing game six to catfish honor and seventy three. That's the I mean. He lost three two one two catfish hunter in that game game six with the Mets up three games to two when the series, and you know, you could argue the point that Yogi should've pitch George stone in that game and save Stephen for game seven that forever instead of coming back up with Matlock pitched on two days rest day, if I'm not mistaken in that game seven, but it looks even worse game one the World Series. The orioles. I haven't approached with this question. I mean, you know, if you give the right answer to this question is gonna make me look, very smart. If you disagree that it's just time big game. Who even the baseball to Tom Seaver, Jerry Kouzmin. Tough call. It's a tough call. Jerry Kouchner was better in the World Series and six in sixty nine one both starts. Yeah. Okay. So isn't that kind of game one tremendous had like a no hitter through seven innings of game too. I think they want to to one is that not a. Jerry kouzmine was a we start talking about guys who are hall of fame caliber bitches, it might be seen. I don't know if you'd better pitcher, Jerry Coleman, and Jerry coups was not even thought about it. All right. But that's the pride that the questions are set. Don't be Jerry kouzmines to twenty two and two. Oh, nine with a three three six, right? Okay. The province. He's never led the league in anything except loss. You never wanna Cy Young twenty one year for the Mets. Yep. Nineteen seventy seven right. He finished second in the Cy Young voting once. So that's good. Was that the Randy Jones Seventy-six? Yeah. You tell me Mandy Joanie one in ten six nine Jones. At a Padres wanted. The no one would ever dispute Tom Seaver was better pitcher and Jerry Kouzmin. Yet. When I asked her coups tremendous pitcher. Not knocking them. Tom was one of the greatest of all. But if I ask you who you rather starting to big game you thought about that's all you need tremendous. That's why doesn't get probably the credit. He deserves. Right. That's why like somebody could call up today. And I would get it. If they said, I would understand if they said, you know, what I'd rather start Andy Pettitte the big game in Roger Clemens. I get down. Does anybody think? No. He wasn't better. Okay. So that point when people make it it's a resident did he if you should go to the hall of fame who's been when twenty foot of twins too. He did. Correct. Nineteen seventy nine twenty games. He won twenty games twice in his career once with the Mets the twins. But he led the league in losses twenty. Did. He did loosen the strike short season. So you kind of. A very good career. Now, he was he was very good. But it just shows you the difference between do I trust this guy in a game versus as he better than that guy. Ozzie in woodridge. What's up guys? Hi. Hi, guys. How're you doing? Not as good as you was that is true. Short list of guys doing better than Ozzie Ozzie who I love on your team kind of getting a loving actually believe it or not the Atlanta Hawks. I love John Collins you deal with his trade. You ready? I'm gonna give you I'm gonna give route. And I'm gonna give you Denver's number one. Wow. And I'll throw in the Knicks second round pick. Wow. Would you make that trade? Let's go live. Now. I gotta go back. Yeah. We can develop my own place. No, Kenny Kenny Kenny Kenny spellcheck now. No. Hey, Greg it out of the. His rep was developing young players. And he sure is doing that. I always giving them credit for that the two things I rip them forward was not playing cards and number two just their lack of execution late games, which they've cleaned up. Their great Layton games now. But that John Collins you got green building block to build around. He's a hell of a player, man. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. He's better than me. I'm happy for Andy Pettitte getting the, you know, the number of votes to be alive again next year for the hall voting because I want him to be just like he was the first known that being enshrined in somewhere like monument park. I want him to have the honor of being the first known use had to go into the hall as well. Come on. You you you can't you can't stand dandy Pettit? I know. Yeah. I know. I know what can I tell you tell me what what are you have more respect for Roger Clemens who pose a shaggy who basically got caught and says it wasn't me than I do for Andy Pettitte who hid behind family. And God when he admitted it though. Ozzy. Cambrian God Ozzie. Why do you think Andy Pettitte used HGH because him and rocket where anabolic brothers and wherever the rocket went Andro when they were. Drugs image. No. The timing of winning. The did it kind of leads towards the belief that he did it to recover from injury. I have a question for you. Do you have a problem with guys using HGH to recover from injury? Evan who is his best friend? And then following them to Houston cool them, and you don't think that they were training together. And they were doing it together. I think. That I didn't dispute that and by the way, I've Roger Clemens go to the baseball hall of fame is would you have a problem if I did HGH now you want a fifty dollars on your driver. Dak prescott. Probably no it wouldn't make him a better throwaway. He's not a window. Just throw. You think they weren't training together? And he didn't use it for performance reasons. Then I believe I believe based on the facts that were out there that Andy Pettitte did it to recover from it. I do too. Okay. I due do today admitted it did admit it Roger Clemens never admitted. Nothing. This guy admitted he's still denying it to this day. I mean, you still like, you know, as clean as a whistle. You know, who's the guy again was the guy that was. That he was involved with the guy who was the country singer. Now got now. Oh, Brian Mac OS their trainer McNamee says NBA McNamara. What about him? He was like. Supposedly like shoot his wife. Yes. I mean, God some of the stories like ridiculous. Yeah. They they are kinda crazy. But you know, what I'm going to give is Ozzy credit for his call, even though he's just a Yankee hair. Right. We have spent a decent amount of this show talking about independent and talking about his career. And that may have been the first time we even talked about HD age, which shows you how little that impacts most people like no one brings it up, right? Even the guys I guarantee who are anti-steroid guys even he doesn't bring it up with Andy Pettitte forgotten Mandy McCreary Mindy mccleary. I know, unfortunately, really, very unfortunate sad story. But the HGH steroids performance enhancing drug thing, it never stuck with Andy Pettitte. To me. I would not vote for him. Because of that..