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If we haven't suffered for in his latest book titled freedom. Sebastian younger examines. It's many iterations and definitions best younger. Of course the journalist author and filmmaker sebastian. Welcome back to the show. And it's good to talk to you. Thank you thanks for having me back. Thank you very much for being here so Especially we don't learn till the end of your book why you did what you did but Explain to people what you did do. Okay yeah and what you find out at. The end is not why we took this trip. I it was just happened to be going on in my life at the time so me and a few friends a few friends in ice i think it's chromatic. Cut a few friends and i all of us Had been in combat decided to walk along the railroad lines from washington dc to philadelphia and then instead of continuing to new york where i live We wheeled and headed west for pittsburgh and crossed the state of pennsylvania mostly along the journey river And this is all along the railroad lines. Which are these swaths of no-man's-land that crisscross america to legal to be on them private property but there are no cops out there they find out you're out there they'll come looking for you. Were looking for his helicopter. At one point we managed to evade them but we call it high speed vagrancy. Harriet everything we needed our backs. Remove ten fifteen twenty miles a day. We were sleeping under bridges. Earn abandoned buildings or out in fields. We cooked over fires and got our water out of creeks and we walked through the ghettos of america and the rich suburbs and the factories and farms in the wilderness and in the end we covered about four hundred miles over the course of a year in multiple trips. And as i say in the book at night we were usually the only people in the world who knew where we were and there are many definitions of freedom but surely that's that's one of them and probably one of the more interesting ones. Yeah i want to get back to the motivation the second but you know margin. I have spent a lot of time on the radio unless you month apologizing for how much we don't know about the history of asians in this country black people in this country. I've got to add one thing to this list railroad building. I i have to say i. I was aware that there was a lot of carnage around the construction itself. But i was not nearly as aware as i am now about all the suffering that surrounded it. Could you talk to us a little bit about what you describe in the book. Yeah i mean. The railroads were vital to linking the american interior To the to the To the coastal communities in the east coast primarily I mean the heartland was growing the food and the coastal cities were Engaging with europe and the rest of the world trade and and you had to unite those. Somehow there's this mountain ridge between them that had to be crossed and the rivers. Don't cross it so they had to blast through with railroads but those rebuild with you know high explosives. And through their bill through malarial swamps. And you know just the whole nature of that kind of enterprises extremely dangerous and they use a lot of cheap immigrant. Labor and people died by the scores by the hundreds by the thousands of and often were buried in unmarked graves and the railroad towns themselves. You know when when they built the transcontinental railroad than the eighteen seventies. the town's themselves were they would spring up along the railroad tracks that were thousands of workers would live for a while until they moved on to the next stretch. We're incredibly violent places. And i read this fascinating book Correlating of violence the basically the fewer women there already community the higher the rate of violence and these were communities they were almost exclusively male and and the rates of the murder rate was seven percent month or something. I can't remember the exact number but it was something like that. It was unbelievably i. I mean it was as high as battlefield deaths basically and the railway. Wasn't there one guy. I read this portion about two. Am in the morning over the weekend. Was there one guy who was construction magnet or something like that. Who was the would only allow himself to ride on. The initial run was at not because he was concerned about. How dangerous would be that. I get that right. Yeah i mean building. Railroads were dangerous. Operating was also david dangerous and riding was very dangerous and so this initial run. I can't remember the name the rubber but the the the owner of the railroad company insisted on being alone in the engine running the thing. Because if it didn't go well he wanted to be the only person who was killed by the way. Let me say that's real leadership right. I talk about leadership later in my book. I mean free. Societies need brave leaders who are willing to take their own risks for their people and acid. It's amazing example. Ask before leaving. Can you explain what the term railroad spine is. Which i've never heard before. Oh yeah so. The accidents on the early railroads and continuing to today are just horrific. You know like they were like the plane. Crashes of the eighteen hundreds early nineteen hundreds hundreds of people involved. And i mean the the the there was it was run on steam right so if the boiler cracked open everyone was scalded to death dozens god scores of people would die and so the deep trauma from these from these accidents and people would die. Eighty one hundred

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