Dayton, El Paso And Ohio discussed on FiveThirtyEight Politics


Were killed over a single weekend in mass shootings in dayton ohio and paso taxes since then pulling his shirt an increase in concerns over the threat of white nationalism and support for stricter gun laws remains the majority opinion as it has for a while congress is on on recess and won't be back until labor day but twenty twenty democratic candidates have continued to talk about the attacks on the trail. I want to start with you two weeks out. Does it seem seem like the el paso and perhaps maybe dayton too but of course el paso brings in the issue of white nationalist terrorism as well but does it seem like those mass shootings were a defining moment in american politics. I think they were and we can discuss how we defined american politics but i think if you look at how the new york times other publications are recovering white nationalism trump's speeches fox news has been a lot of stories saying this shooters words and messages we're echoed from trump speeches and so on the episode he wrote came from trump's ideas. Essentially i'm seeing a lot of stories about people calling in or the local law enforcement enforcement arresting people who put up who have written about white supremacy and there seems like there's a heightened attention in the public and from law enforcement on the idea that white nationalism awesome is shooting sippy coming so i do think that the media and maybe institutions outside of government in some ways are changing their approach and their since the white nationalist. I think the f._b._i. My guess is going to be more than this. I do the institutions are changing and i think it might be galvanizing in debt way without dislike changing zhing kind of votes in congress well my actually my initial response to that question was going to be no but i think peres right. It's like maybe maybe they enter something like it did produce some lasting change in terms of how as perry said people and institutions treat and think of white nationalism awesome but not with guns because on guns. I don't think we've seen as many changes. I mean we've talked about guns before on this podcast. It's always in the same framework of like is public opinion on gun control changing and i think we've generally come to the conclusion that it has sort of steadily league changed and gotten more in favor of gun control and i would guess push back a little bit and say so the republican governor of ohio. Obviously one of the shootings was in dayton. Mike dewine called for a version of a red flag law so it's background checks things like that and i think trump maybe initially wanted to support but then perhaps actually today i think he made some noise about well. Remember we already have a lot of background checks and it's really about mental health so he kinda yeah yeah but i i guess i would say with every shooting. There does seem to be i think some nominal change as far as the idea of talking about white nationalism and talking about white supremacy which i actually think our interestingly those definitions are being refined quite a bit so talking about right wing terrorists and use the using the language of this is a white nationalist people in the media drawing comparisons to well. Some of the shootings like san bernardino not no that was sort of an isis inspired terrorist attack so this shooting in el paso was a white nationalist inspired terrorist attack. They're essentially the same kind of thing we should talk about them in the same way but i think the white supremacy idea is the one you're seeing like tucker carlson push back on in this way where he sang white supremacy is only the k. k. k. and people who go to meetings and tattoo swastikas on their heads and do that kind of thing whereas whereas i think a lot of institutions are smartly and rightly talking about white supremacy as the idea that systemic racism consists and that it's promoted in various ways cultural and political over hundreds of years but that's a hard concept for people to get a hold of and that i think has been more difficult. I think the idea of designating white nationalist terrorists in the same category we as muslim terrorism is is like an easier job for the media to do the white supremacy conversation is much harder and it's tied into slavery slavery and everything that came from that in america so it's like talking about american history in a radically different way yeah that seems to me i do think the media media has with white nationalist or white supremacist terror attacks takes up much more of the position as they do with al qaeda terrorism as it existed or isis terrorism. I mean so are you. Are you guys saying that in a way. The american conception of the threat of white nationalism has changed. It sounds like yes. I think the unequivocally yes. This is a much more serious under well-understood threat than it was three weeks ago and that it is a meaningful change in the electorate and institutions that matters even if there's no gun control bill bill that passes next week. I'm not predicting any legislation. I'm just saying that. I think that these kinds of cultural changes do matter and i think something happened the last two weeks but you think it'll last perry i do i do you think there will be more of a focus on somebody wrote some weird post on their facebook page but how they jews and i think it would be more likely that the cops city city will be like lemme do something before the walmart get shot up. I think there'll be more aggression around these kinds of things in thinking. It's like isis. Certainly let claire said i think that is and i think there's gonna be permanent. Yes i do there was a shooting that was supposedly stopped by law enforcement right that was similarly alertly motivated like white nationalism motivated. The identification of that in american media has probably been slightly slowed slowed down by outlets like fox news where if it's a right wing extremist ak what we're now calling white nationalism because it's almost always that

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