Prostitution, New York, United States discussed on en(gender)ed



What is the reasoning behind it? People are saying that people have a right to have a genetic family. But don't women have the right to not be guinea pigs for corporate Industry you know this. It's the question that we always see. Do Women Have Rights? You know do art to are women protected from the harms of the Industry. And when it comes to this extra when it comes to surrogacy we see. The answer is no so before the bill was passed. Wasn't there surrogacy already well. There was this. Altruistic surrogacy is a thing right and and but altruistic surrogacy is a lot different than commercial surrogacy because altruistic. Surrogacy is like you know. Let's say my friend wanted to have a baby but she was infertile and I knew how much you wanted to be a mother and I said or I'll do this for you out of the goodness of my heart because you're my best friend and I want to do this for you. That is a much different bond then a contract because the bond between a surrogate mother and intended parents under full commercial surrogacy is nothing more than ink on a pen. It's a contract and we've heard dozens of stories of women. Women of color particularly who had wealthy white intended parents and the white intended parents would use racial slurs against the mother and not pay for any of the mothers Means while she was pregnant with their surrogate child and then the mother gives birth and the child is yanked away from the mother. It's overall physically emotionally traumatic experience and we have just sanctioned it as a market as an industry. Just go crazy. It's going to be a free for all of the industrialization of women's what about people celebrities like Sarah Jessica Parker and Kim Kardashian. They've famously had surrogate children or children born through surrogacy. That wasn't there some sort of commercial transaction there. Why was that legal? I mean I don't know those cases particularly I imagine that a lot of these folks living California maybe but I mean those people sort of give an example of our surrogate parent. The surrogate parents are people with significant wealth. They have a lot of money. Surrogacy is not cheap but the money that goes into the surrogacy process is not seen by the surrogate mother. You know and the money in itself. It goes back to The issue of prostitution in a way. Because does the money itself or the sanctioning of a market where that money can even be exchanged. Does that excuse? The harms that women encounter when they're going through the surrogacy process. I mean there are stories. Two Girls Young Girls who are twenty something healthy brilliant young woman who sign up to be egg donors and you know die. Within five or ten years from unexplained cancers and we're talking about women who have never had health issues to begin with and that's because I don't know if you're familiar with the process of donation or to be a surrogate to begin with but you need to be injected with a lot of hormones so that you produce I think like up to fifteen times the number of eggs in one cycle so you a lot of times women who are going through the process. Get something that's known as Hyper Burien Syndrome. Which is deadly. You know it could be fatal. We're talking about science. That has not been researched enough for us to now pass industry-driven bills on women's health. This sounds a lot like you know when you were talking about. I I mean I. I'm aware of this bill from the support that celebrities such as Sarah Jessica Parker Have given it. But in the worst case scenario getting back to the sex trafficking conversation you know if there's no regulation at all. I can imagine how someone who's interested in child sex trafficking would want to get to create children actually then traffic them and put them into child pornography or whatever. It is to create some sort of mechanism for earning money. Yeah yeah absolutely and you know I could also see Traffickers Pimps who control women in the system of prostitution sort of offering being a surrogate as break so to speak to you know. Get off get out of prostitution in become surrogate like it's just it's a market and a lot of people are going to be entrepreneurs for lack of better words and they're going to abuse it. That's without a doubt and you know what's interesting about celebrity. You hearing this from occurred The US is one of the few countries to have full commercial surrogacy. It's been banned in so many in more. In more than most countries I think full surrogacy is banned because they recognized how harmful this is and how dangerous and how under researched this. This entire thing is and it's we're talking countries where like relatively speaking women aren't even woman woman on are still still face a lot of oppression in these countries but still their governments recognized that full surrogacy is deadly and in unacceptable but the US doesn't. It's just very strange. I think the European Union India Thailand they've all band full commercial. Surrogacy I just don't know how we got here and I think the only explanation for it is the influence of people with massive wealth and industries and unfortunately those groups run America in a lot of a lot of ways So it's just a reflection of our priorities and our priorities don't involve women's rights a lot of the what I've heard and read about why women are reluctant to leave beyond the coercion and the financial factors are the cultural ones in terms of being stigmatized. That they won't be able to enter society and some sort of have some sort of economic role that you know that they'll be able to access because of their history and so it's really interesting. How there's this dichotomy where on the one hand people are sorted legitimizing it in calling it sex work and yet. That's the same reason that people don't want to leave because they also are self sigma -tising and getting back to the bill for decriminalizing. It lacks just as much in terms of regulation as the Child Parent Safety Act. I heard because any home any domicile can be turned into a brothel and there were no restrictions around advertising so you could have advertisements on the subway or on buses that promote prostitution as a job to two girls right. And we've we've seen that we've seen the there was something that a sex worker advocacy organization here. New York had a an exhibit and they were advertising all over the set of ways. Thanks to a healthy fund from open society foundations which also fund the global sex trade. So yeah these people have access to massive wealth because there is vested interest in securing sexual access to women So people want to put their money behind it and they do and we see that saw. The same thing is going to happen with surrogacy. I believe I mean we don't. We don't even need to go very far to see that this is true. We can just look at the language of the bill and see that a literal corporation wrote this so at the end of the day. We just follow the money right. Where is the money? It's all behind the sex trade. You know it's not with survivors of prostitution. Who are talking about how harmful their buyers are. It's not talking about survivors of the sex trade who say yeah. I did this to pay rent but I wish I didn't. I wish I wish college wasn't so expensive. I wish this. I wish that I wish I could live a life. You know decently without having to be exploited by the male gaze. You know it's follow the money and you'll see it's not with us. Is there anything we can do now? That the bill has been passed to try to minimize the harm to women. Yeah I think The surrogacy issue New York is a is a massive upset. I don't think that we should just. I don't think we should give up too soon. Because the full decriminalization. Bill is still on that. That fight is still on. And I'm happy to say that. A lot of advocates with the New Yorkers for the equality model which involve direct service providers lifelong activists Lawyers you name it survivors primarily you name it. They're with us. We have put together a bill for the equality model that we are excited to introduce to the New York Senate very soon hopefully but that is what I think. We should rally around. You know. We've seen how ferocious the fight is legally especially when you have mega corporations behind it but that doesn't mean that we can't go against it and it means that we shouldn't go because you know how many suffragettes were there. How many women did it take to start the global feminist movement? Just one just a couple you know. So if we all rallied together not let something like surrogacy. Get us down. I think that we could you know. Come out of this. A Lot. Stronger and We'll set a precedent in New York if we pass the equality model here Where you know corporations will not win. Do THEY WILL BAY. May when a few battles. But they won't win. The war would definitely gonNA including those links so please share them with absolutely so Laura were at the point of our conversation where we ask every guest. The same set of questions that I've adopted from inside the actors studio call the engendered questionnaire and the first question is what is at stake in the struggle to end. Gender-based violence and oppression. What's at stake? Go the lives of our sisters. I mean I think it's that simple. When we think about Mel violence and we think about Patriarchy and oppression. We have to remember that those things are not natural with the tagline for firms organizing decolonize. Feminism because when we're when we're talking about decolonization that is removing these systems of oppression that have been imposed on our sisters. Both here and abroad. We see that things like Patriarchy are not normal. You know those things are not inherent to our existence so I think remembering where we came from is at stake. The lives of our sisters are at seek also remembering where we're going and that's to a feminist future where women are not the exception. What gives you hope. Oh Oh the same thing my sister. I think this fight is so hard. Oh my gosh I think every day we look at each other and we think we're over this But again there's a lot of us in. We are lesion but the power of money and influence is not on our side and yet we win. And how insane is that? How insane is it that a group of fifteen fierce feminist in any given state of the US with nothing but a couple of dollars in their pocket can make waves and change laws? That is what gives me hope. Because I've seen it and I intend on continue doing it and final question. What can we do? More of less of start or stop to end gender-based violence and oppression. We need to do more reading. We need to do more reading. I feel like every time I read a reactionary argument. It's something that could easily be debunked. Aw If if you just do your basic women's rights wheat reading read revolutionaries read activists read freedom fighters. Step away from buzzfeed. Read people who have done the good fight and why they're doing it because you'll get a lot of wisdom and a lot of guidance and we wouldn't be here today for if it weren't for them so we definitely need to do a lot more reading we need to do a lot more reflection At this especially goes to you. I don't know how large your mail listener audiences but this definitely goes to the men in our lives. Patriarchy has emboldened men in such a way that certain violent behaviors are inherent to their attitudes and their behaviors. And I think men needs to do a lot of self reflection you know. It's not easy but for you to be a feminist ally Because that I believe is is omen. Could be our allies to the feminist movement. It requires a lot of humbling. And that's really hard. I know we talked about pornography briefly but when it comes to that issue when it comes to the straight I think a lot of men can get on board but when my experiences the final frontier for them is pornography because we as a society have justified. Things like ethical porn or feminist porn. But if you can apply the same concepts of industry and oppression onto the street he could do the same for pornography So that is definitely what we need. More of. We need more sisterhood. You know we need more Women who are who wants to be feminists but not the fun kind. What I mean by that is a woman who adopts like one of the boys. Feminism what I call pro feminism things that viewed right into misogyny and patriarchal expectations but making it pink and therefore making feminists. We definitely need more sisterhood. And that's going to me in coming off as you know a a B word sometimes but if we don't have one another's backs than what do we have read Andrea Dworkin read Audrey and join the firm all right. Well thank you so much. Laura and I.

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