This bad in the obama administration but we did have some bad ones me. Can you talk about what it feels like to be inside. The white house consumed by multiple crises. Miss thinking back to from not fun. Thinking back to sort of like the the most tumultuous periods and i got the national security council spokesman job in january of twenty ten right before the haiti earthquake in then the arab spring and there was a period around Benghazi and you can see what it's like on biden's face you can see it. Jigsaw vin tony blankets face when they're when they're briefing after benghazi seven. Am room check ins and then seven pm later that day when you do go home you know. You're not getting sleep. You're getting caught in the middle of the night was our update from the situation room You're getting new information constantly. You know that some of that information is going to be wrong but you still have to brief congress yourself to brief the press in real time to the best of your ability. You're trying to get answers from people in different continents in different time zones. You're trying to coordinate and hold accountable. Massive government agencies like the pentagon and the state department and you tell community and actually get them to do what you want them to do. And then if you're jigsaw alvin or tony blinken your briefing the president and the vice president and you're dealing with however they feel your moment. They're probably not there. Biding probably pretty happy. Right now understandably and it's it's completely unsustainable and then on top of that you can't just drop all the shit you have to do you know i mean. I read the wall street journal. This morning. there's a report that north korea is resuming nuclear enrichment. I'm sure that nfc is meeting about that. The the prime minister of israel was in town on thursday the day of the attack. You're supposed to meet with biden like you can't just drop him This hurricanes barreling down so like they are in the barrel and the fallout from this. In terms of the impact on the administration the individuals involved. Congress like it's just beginning at the beginning of this. Yeah in in. You've gotta remember that these are these are human beings right. everyone is tired. everything is reactive right. There's very little time for planning or for proactive messaging about any of the You know agenda items. You wanna pass. I think they were like they had planned to talk about the economic plan and hold events. Do any of that you know commoner supposed to campaign with gavin newsom that gets cancelled or these are just small things but like when you're in the white house and there's like ten different things hitting you at once and all you have to do is you don't have time to like really sort of digest a bunch of information and then react you're reacting in real time constantly there's a foxhole mentality when you're just getting attacked all the time and trying to push back it is it is fucking brutal brutal brutal on your best day on the right like i mean one of the most like weirdly soul crushing times for me in the administration were the days after the bin laden operation because the us leads us unbelievable on precedent operation to kill osama bin laden. We ask john brennan. Who has been hunting that fucker for fifteen years. Who like literally killed people he knew and john briefs get some facts wrong. Based on the information he added the time and then like we spend a week having john called a liar and trying to sort of like cleanup or walk back mistakes we made and the and that's what they were their mistakes. They but you. They get framed as lies reference to mislead the press. I mean jake solve incredibly well loved. Like he's like the nicest the brilliant guy he's super thought phobic. He looks like you know he's been in the barrow time. I remember when remember the oil spill in in two thousand ten In the obama white house and it was all consuming there. Was you know every single cable channel. We're talking about the oil spill and there was like a little box in the bottom of the screen that just showed the oil shooting out into the gulf. And saying you know obama's like the worst presence carter and he's not doing anything about the that he ju. Yeah that barack obama is not personally figure out how to get that and plug it in scuba tank. And i remember robert gibbs tells the story that they're all sitting in and gives his office and obama's there and a bunch of other visors and as they're figuring out this oil spill crisis so says oh by the way there's this article rolling stone but stan mcchrystal and now he has to fire stan mcchrystal kim house me and that crisis happens as you're dealing with the oil spill crisis right and so this is these multiple things happened at once and it's it's it's pretty brutal also that like so much of what in situations like that. So much of what is unfolding. Is the question. Will this crisis negatively impact. The politics of this administration of everything else is doing and so often the way that political punditry and political coverage works. The question will this have a negative. Political impact on the administration is the means by which the crisis creates a negative political impact on the administration. You end up in this sort of like rhetorical loop of. We're still talking about this. Isn't that because of bunch of dumb democrats answer phone calls from politico or the wall street journal or whoever and say oh yeah. I'm really worried about this impact. The midterm unburden yourself to a reporter to really make it feel good. I mean looking for like jake in the nfc people like all you can do is hope that the nfc process and structure that you built kin like hold all the weight that you're trying to carry in the moment and weeks like this. You're not always sure that it can. So republicans have been pretty clear that their argument for the midterms will be that. The country's fallen into chaos joe biden is to weakening competent to do anything about it How worried to the white democrats. Be about that message. And how should they think about responding. I think that they should be worried about the message. Insofar as the country is in chaos and dissolution do. I think they should be worrying about it. In terms of like the specific news cycle of this moment no i think joe biden will be judged by his actions but the actual consequences of his policy choices and beyond that they need to the i think they are doing. Their best to kind of share information manage the the news cycles as they're happening without being so buffeted by them that they changed course. And i think that is i. Think the signature aspect of the way. This administration has done politics from the beginning. It is partly drove. It's our job and became president. I think it's actually how jen psaki conduct yourself in that briefing room incredibly while every single day And i think that is their strength. They know when to respond and they know when not to respond And as long as they keep doing that and the the the test for this administration will actually play out with what's happening with the infrastructure bill. What's happening with the with the You know giant When we call it the other one the other one part of the problem with better. Better plan.