Writer, Max Martin, Mike Posner discussed on Switched On Pop
Yeah so well well. It's a public debate in which Max Martin wrote the lyric and our underground day didn't sing it because it was grammatically incorrect and they had a dispute in the in the studio about this they have there's interviews there. Were talking about this and she said I don't want to sing it that way. I don't WanNa sing the wrong word and he's like. Nobody wanted the town right. He wanted the ride with the previous line analyst matter yeah totally and so when she sings the line it kind of sounds like now who have become where really and I think there's like she closes her mouth and gets a little at the end just as a like you know. Fu I'm going to right well. Let me let me tell you in in that world because my main collaboration home is is at maximum. If there's an M. at the end they know it. They discussed it and everyone in the room disgusted and my assumption is that I would assume Peter Karlsson did the vocals on that. My guess is that we could one text away from but if there's if there's something like that that's it that's a choice it only hip hop and country tree. I really art forms. They speak to English speaking audiences only knows just every dialing but when you're doing pop music at the level that Arianna has been doing in that specific style of of that song it's built for people around the world sing along to it so sometimes lear it can be secondary to the sound of the word and that's okay part of what is so compelling about her is there so much but the way in which which she pronounces her words is incredibly idiosyncratic. It can only be song by her in her unique way of saying that word informing forming that vowel I love it so that's our biggest dispute we've ever had and I think we have all sorts of other often. Just sort of musical logical questions Sion's that occur and we're constantly trying to convince each other things but I don't think if we were on shock jock radio or even on youtube that would allow for that back and fourth in which we all get to engage in hearing from different perspectives one of the thing I've learned from and the writer is is when I prepare for these interviews news and I was alluding to this earlier. I'm going through. Somebody's discography and Allee Willis talked about it and her. She's the one who wrote the theme from friends. You know amazing writer but when you look at somebody's discography when you see all these hits coming out. That's the easy time to ask questions Russians. The hard part is when there's this what looks like a two year low three year lull and anybody who's listening to this when you're going through a three year. Hello it's excruciating. You don't know what's going to happen but I can guarantee. Almost all of them are building something. That's when the writing those hits that's Aspen. They're figuring out what the next sound is. That's when they're writing their musicals. That's in their writing their long form whatever it is that's in the writing their TV show or their book book. It's always in this lull and then when it comes out it comes out in two thousand and twenty two and all of a sudden. It's like wow what a year all things happening for you. What's it like and that's really just a celebration of the struggle from the previous three four years and it's so easy to ask people questions about about the songs are released to just because of logic of course. You'RE GONNA ask that but the real questions aren't what's happening in the years that are good but I'm so interested in the years where it seems like nothing's happening to the outsider. I want to ask you about this. I was asked recently about do artists have less room for reflection and the opportunity to develop develop new work in that. There's such a demand for ongoing content. Release constant single drops alum after album get right on tour. Well okay so this depends on who the artist is in order not to segue but I'll just mention it so my day job is so much creating a song on on Friday that comes out on Friday to be done on Friday two weeks song cycle you know in the in the best case scenario. It's something they go to radio and they're willing to spend six months on but the cost of radios increasingly expensive the artists cares less and less about how much they're making on on any of these things things because they're making money on touring you know the artist who's patient who comes out with art ends up being being the Bruno. Mars is you know it ends up being the Adele's it becomes these artists that are the ones that are constantly celebrated uh-huh the ones who come out and try to play the content game they're successful for a while and if they have the correct amount of followers on their DSP's he's the algorithm will work in their favor and they'll make money regardless of the quality of the music but if you're trying to break in the business more is not more to me less than way less is more. If you spend a year five years ten years working on a project that's truly worthy of word of mouth mouth. You're more likely to have the success of switched on pop because it's word of mouth as we were discussing than it will be being successful because of the the amount of content. This is something I've really noticed that there has to be a real relationship. I don't think you develop a fan base off offers of as a fence on you have to have some relationship there. There has to be a real emotional connection that people have thing and when people wouldn't songwriters asked me for advice. I'm who who is your community. That who are you communicating with. Why do they need the thing that you're creating. Why does it matter and if you can't answer those questions very well. What are you making. What are you doing. You're probably doing it for for fame alone. The the discipline of the job is really important in a night. I talk about that a lot where treat it like. It's a job you know show up. Studier craft all the great artists in all different genres. All different art forms studied unless they were prodigies and those exist too but maybe for most of us who are in the world. You were probably not prodigies probably had to work at it and had to learn learn and you might have all the instincts in the world but assuming you weren't fourteen when you had your first major hit and you were you know your whole youth was not in the limelight because because of your prejudice ways you have to study and you have to keep studying you have to keep working on it and you're only job is to entertain your audience. This is not about you. All as a writer stopped showing me that you know how to right right so that way as a listener I'm affected. Take it about the listener not about yourself so this. This is a sort of a segue to one of my other favorite moments which was a competition that I had with Mike Posner. I believe you've also had on your show. Oh and who's the like sage wisdom of the of the songwriting world love the opening of his new record in which in the intro he basically says is if you don't have time to listen to this all the way through and just listen that's fine. Just don't listen right now. Come back to it when you have time because I'm trying to. I WanNa share something with you and it's going to be a magical thing. Just let's do it together and I think it was kind of a bold choice in speaking with him. I feel like I learn constantly all the ways in which the rules apply until the rules don't apply and I had a great conversation with him about his songs song about you which was a hit a few months back and there's this wonderful little line in there where he breaks all your expectations really into. They not rhyming like a lot of Ryan Yeah in my career and sometimes it gets in the way you did a book of poetry in I found some ways poetry was is a lot more real or like harder in Lega Detroit. SORTA ways harder in that. I don't mean more difficult means like grittier because you just say so. We're playing around with not rhyming a lot and I think that's really what makes the Song Dope to me still Alice Alison late in the first versus say since you've been going on thing to do as sleep until noon now a feel bad that should rhyme but it doesn't and that's really awesome to me. That's also also ricky reed song to Ricky Reed's credit the he wants to work with artists and doesn't necessarily think about songs as the priority even though he respects the song and he came from writing hits on some producing hit songs he's so into the idea of artists and artists pal and I think I think that's interesting that the things that you've brought up have been from what seemed to inspire US specifically our artis Addis from podcast. That's often about pop songs. what is it about artists that inspire by you versus pop songs or is it just coincidence. I feel like I'm always wrestling with this tension. That pop music is is both industry it commerce and it is pop art. Both these things are happening sometimes in very unequal measure these these scales are balanced very very differently per person per artists. You know I love work that like a great pop. Song just grabs you by the collar and the the a year worm is immediately in there and you're singing it after the first listen. I love a good hook but I always want more I want I want to be I want that song to evolve in go deeper and have more to offer the more times you listen to it. There's a lot of pop that can be Saccharin. You you get a taste of it and then on the second or third listeners like like it was it was great super sweet awesome and the by the third year listen. You're like too much sugar. Yeah me to sweep and so with all art. I want things that have those qualities of both. There's something immediate there whether you're musician or not there's something that just grabs you and the more you know the more the thing unfold and there's more beauty to the thing whether whether the composition and the things that I love about the song are intentional or not right like I I love for example breaking down Jillian michaels melodies. Her melodies are brilliant. They oftentimes have you sort of like internal logic to them where she'll do this tiny little step wise motif in the verse that comes back in the post chorus but then gets expanded upon and when I talked with transfer a few months back he's like yeah. That's stuff's happening happening in the room. It's it's not intentional but I love the way in which there can be that beautiful compositional. Wujek allows us to blossom and blossoming blossom and another thing is Liz. Mike Posner and Jillian michaels are all writers in the room who tend to be off the cuff tend to freestyle obviously they understand craft craft as well but all three of them really freestyle. La And what you get is what they spew out into the microphone almost more in jazz sense sure yeah edited you know Max Martin Sense and I love his work as well. I mean breaking down oops. I did it again and looking at the complementary commentary choruses and counterpoint that you know is like up there with Baroque style counterpoint is brilliant. I love that stuff. I think he almost has the inverse where you know someone who's so detailed and exact in his composition and yet the first time you hear it feels light and obvious and just like it just came out of anywhere and then you go deeper deeper deeper into it has more to offer one of the things that Tania's did on the last album where he would adjust the mix once they were released. That's something that I think we'll see more of. I mean right now. Just working on the show part part of the wrong man. There's twenty five songs in the show and they're different songs. The album like Wli like this shows. The thing is different. It's still growing and that's the way we're obviously not. Everybody's trying to do like an album into a show but the idea that art is not done we get it off when people do do a remix where they have somebody else coming on this on new feature that they'll re release the song with the new feature but like the idea that I don't know why artists can't go back and rewrite verse rewrite a pre chorus or chorus why they can't all the artists talk about what after they've toured how all man if they would record it now it would sound so different because they recorded it. They've performed a two hundred something time different of thousands of people you have a whole other perspective so I don't know why we don't go in and rewrite songs that have been released. Why just because it's out in the world. Can you not adjust it to make a better. I would imagine if Taylor swift went back and so you know what I could probably think of one part of this new song besides a precor school really fast but probably make that of course a little more exciting if she decided to do that you know no matter what but my point is. I bet she couldn't about everyone. Ruined listened to it. I like Everton better. We just did a piece about Aladdin and how there has been a very strong response to to Prince Ali in particular. A lot of people have been complaining. It doesn't sound as good the new the new version has compared to the old version and one thing we notice that it's a lot slower. actually a little bit slower. ABM slower and it's a half step down and maybe people are sort of feeling sluggish. We did this piece and then we got so much mail about how they hear the song and a myriad of different different ways including different emphasis different levels of swing in the music and these subtle differences that I'm I hadn't heard the original in a long time hadn't seen Aladdin since I was an adolescent and so I I didn't pick up on these..