European Union, Brexit, UK discussed on All Things Considered


Looks like a better decision down the road than it does today? I think there could I mean, remember, Brexit is really about the idea of national sovereignty. It's not about economics. And this is how Boris Johnson put it on Christmas Eve. When he finally got that trade deal, The British people voted to take back control of their money, their borders, their laws. And, of course, that's in an economic cost, Ari. Another potential scenario where Brexit looks a little better. Is it politically? The U becomes even harder to manage. And the U. K in the end is glad that I got out when it did. That's NPR's Frank Langfitt. Thank you for all of your coverage of the story over the years, and particularly today on this historic moment. Great to talk. All right, all right, from the edge of the English Channel. Let's have now to Oxford, where on and men and is director of the UK in a changing Europe. That's a think tank with a focus on Brexit. Welcome. Thank you having me Want to scale from solid wind to utter disaster. Where would you put this deal very much towards the wind side because by the time we reached sort of Christmas, and of course, the deal was finally done on Christmas Eve. We have a binary choice, which was between deal and no deal. No deal would have been significantly more disruptive significantly more costly and I think, as importantly and no deal outcome would have set the UK and its European partners of loggerheads. Each side blamed the other for the collapse of the talks, and that would have got in the way of cooperation on security. Climate on all kinds of things for weeks, if not months, So compared to that outcome, a deal is a wind from the American perspective. Britain's role as a global leader has been crucial. I mean, the UK has a permanent seat on the U. N Security Council. It's a powerful force in NATO. How do you see that changing after this Brexit deal? And when I say is the one that you miss there is that the UK is also being useful to the U. S. As a friend inside the European Union. That is to say, an Atlanticist liberal free trading state that could shape you decisions and make the case for Atlantis is, um and free trade at the heart of the European Union. I think the U. S. Will miss that. I suspect the UK will make efforts to be an even more activist foreign policy player. Because the government is keen to ram home that message we might have turned our back on European Union membership. But we haven't turned our back on the world or on our responsibilities as a key defender of the liberal international Order. I'm curious is a person who has devoted your professional life to following this saga over the years. Can you just tell us how you Personally feel now that this deal has finally happened, I found I found every step of the journey very, very interesting because so many weird and wonderful things have happened in British politics wonderful, broadly defined from the perspective of a political scientist. You could not how you could not hope to live through or interesting time to study the politics of your country. The other thing for me that is fascinating, though, is that many people, many people who supported Brexit leaving the European Union wasn't and ended itself. It was a means to an end. That is to say, if we leave the European Union, then we can doctor thought you fill in that blank because you won't become a more activist international player Deregulating away. The European Union would never let us so Actually, The real test of Brexit in many ways is yet to come. Which is now you've got that freedom. What the hell are you going to do with it? And how are you going to make people's lives better because of it, despite the fact You're in charge of an economy that is growing less fast. Then it would have done Had we not left in the first place. On and men in is director of the U. K and a change in Europe and professor of European politics and foreign affairs at King's College. London. Thank you for talking with us on this historic day. Absolute pleasure and happy New Year to you. You're listening to all things considered from NPR news. Let's head out to Pacific and now with Hillary Walker And that's where we have one South.

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