Harvey Pratt, Hoopoe, Dave discussed on Coast to Coast AM
To coast to coast AM on K G L eight ten. Welcome back. My first guest is well known to coast audiences for his groundbreaking work on what's become a wildly successful and respected investigative project. The missing for one one series of books and a documentary film by that title. In fact, day Politis was here last month to talk about the latest in that series. He's broadened his his web is net and his focus again, the popularity of those books has overshadowed his original project, the one that got him on the path of pursuing missing persons cases, ten years ago next month, Dave made his first appearance on this program with me to talk about the hookah project a groundbreaking investigation into the big put mystery in which Dave applied, many of the techniques and strategies he learned as a police officer to the sasquatch legend immersed himself in it lived among the Hoopoe, people of northern California and employed. The talents of a forensic sketch artists to give accurate portrayals of what? People have been seeing for a very long time. Well, it may have been focusing on missing four one one but last few years, but never lost interest in Bigfoot. So here he is with a new work. It's an archive of Bigfoot and wild man stories news reports dating all the way back to the year sixteen eighty and while I think Davis probably not likely to take a position on what the answer to the mystery might be. He has pulled together a pretty amazing collection of reports from eye. Witnesses newspapers journalists hunters and others who've seen these creatures up close and personal day. Politis? Welcome back. Hey, George, thanks again for having me. Absolutely. So times on the show. And I appreciate it. So returning to work on Bigfoot. Does this feel like you're dating your ex? It's it's kind of odd. Like you said, it's it's always been stewing in the background. And it's something that's always had my interest. I I think it's an elusive topic that there's a lot of conjecture out there. But not a lot of facts. You'd never stopped working on did you? I mean, you're focused may have been elsewhere. But it's always been sort of you kept them. I out for articles and information. You know, I can't say that I've committed much energy to it in the last seven eight years. Focused on missing people. But when you're going through the archives, and you're trying to pull out articles about missing people. I'm always reading about all kinds of things that I see on these first pages of news news articles, and such and I started come across these. These stories about something that looked like Dixon when you read the articles. But when you read the title it ninety percent of the time, it'll say wild man, and I hadn't done a lot of archive work on the topic before. But. You know, eight years of digging through these archives for missing people articles. I just started to pull them and put them in a folder and over the years. It got large. And eventually, I said, you know, this is pretty intriguing I think even if you're an optimist or pessimist on the topic. It's it's convincing that something over the years has been around us, and it's been documented, and it shows this historic last week that most people don't understand. We're going to get into the specifics articles about Bigfoot wild men and giants and sometimes they're the same and sometimes they're different. But I wanted to just for those who were not listening ten years ago when you were first year can you recap the Hoopoe project? How you got started on that what you learned and how it kinda got its hooks into you all these years later. So I I never had a dog in the fight. I was working for a technology company. I was getting ready to retire. Raise a couple of kids and to the guys I was working with it were superwealthy came to me, and they sat me in this room. And they told a story that independently without knowing each other when they were kids they had a big foot encounter in the mountains of the Sierra. And they found each other later in business and in a weird sort of coincidence. They start talking about Bigfoot and they found each other. And and we're shocked that the each had a similar encounter. And they said, you know, Dave, we have twenty years as a police officer. Or you have years of investigating an HR. You're the guy really to give it that independent. Look, we'll finance. It. You go about it at your own pace. You know, your kids to raise that help us out with this. We really we really wanna find out and initially I said, no. And they kept coming back coming back, and they said at your own pace, you can do it. So I I wonder about looking for an area that had a few things. First of all I wanted internet I needed hotel. And I knew that there was native American history with the topic that ran deep and I needed within say six to eight hour driving location from where I lived at the time in Los Gatos, California, and I coordinate down the area to Hoopoe, which is about thirty miles. South of bluff creek Patterson, give them when film was making sixty seven. So I started to do some geographical research, some topic graphical some weather, and I started to bring this together. And then I went up there and make contact with the Hoopoe police police background, I approach them. And I said, hey, maybe could break down some doors for me. I'm not gonna I'm not going to stretch the truth. I'm going to tell the truth and every witness comes forward. They're going to have to write an affidavit to what they saw under penalty of perjury. And I wanted to raise the bar on the topic a little bit. So that there would be no question about what was stated because they'd sign it and there'd be no question about if the story was fabricated because it was done under perjury. So I started that route in a couple of the cops their new many of the elders. And this was so helpful and breaking down the doors. These guys would introduce me. And they'd say, hey, you can trust this guy. He's a friend. He's credible. And that's the way it got started. And after I heard maybe ten or fifteen of these stories from ultra credible people in and out of the tribe was a store manager that ran this big store Hoopoe that lived miles away who saw one coming into town. I started to think about my police days, and I used to work with a forensic artists. That was just phenomenal. And he would sit down with a witness be able to draw the sketch from just a witness statements and the results were amazing. But I wanted something a slightly different. So I could align this person with a tribal setting and native Americans and found a diamond unbelievable luck an individual name Harvey Pratt who was assistant director of the Oklahoma bureau of investigation and the chief forensic artists FBI trained for the state of Oklahoma and Harvey's not only a world famous artist. He's outstanding law enforcement person and Harvey and I met and right away. We just quick like brothers. And when Harvey would sit down with say a witness to a robbery. And draw the sketch of the suspect and the suspect was later caught. I swear to you. It is like the suspect was in the room and Harvard. You the sketch of the suspect that is how accurate this man is. And so when I brought him into the native American tribe. They mmediately accepted him because he's a cheyenne-arapaho native American chief got a law enforcement background. So it can kind of smell when it happens and Harvey, and I have done this for a long time now together, and we're best friends. We did two books that Hooper project, and then we did a follow up book called tribal Bigfoot where he went outside of hookah and draw sketches of what other people saw again took statements under penalty of perjury. And. Kind of how it started. You said you don't have a dog in the fight meeting. You're not committed to one position or another because there are several different camps in the Bigfoot world, right? Oh, bingo. I started the most local the most audacious the most vulgar are probably the people who believe it's an eight, and they will run you over they will demean you. They will do anything to push that cause. But since they were the most outspoken, I thought well, it's supposed to be true. And I kind of went down that path thinking, well, it must be a must be some kind of background. But I still kept that open mind in when we the first day that we sat down with the people in and around hoop. Andrew the sketches Harvey, myself and Harvey's wife, Gina Pratt. Also, an agent for in Oklahoma. We were sat in stunned disbelief because the sketches were very, Mike. Yeah. They were huge. Yeah. They had hair all over the body. But there was a human quality that you just couldn't miss and they didn't look like apes. They didn't have that eight characteristics that you would think of in a face in a chest cetera. And it was just shocking. And when the witnesses saw the sketches to a lady into a man, they would consistently say Harvey. You nailed it that if xactly what you look like. And when you talk the elders they would consistently say, this is another tribe of people. He's on animals, either people. They had sort of developed a relationship with them at least coexistence, right? Yeah. In the tribal area, I met the one of the managers presidents, chairman of the tribe, and they said, so they looked at a map they said, so this is their area. We don't go in there. And this is your area this is our area, and if they can come into our area and they do regularly, and that's why we see him. Wondering about the hookah areas? The trinity river, I great, salmon and steelhead area has just so much wildlife. And if you drive through Hoopoe from willow creek, you'll notice that there are more berry bushes on the roadways and the surrounding mountains and I've ever seen anywhere in the world. And there's this association with berries and Bigfoot over the years that if you pay attention, and you do the research something about that. And I I know that they're seeing eating a lot. But it's just an odd. Coincidence. Can you? I don't wanna go to deep into the woods, literally and figuratively. But you could use summarize as a law man as a former law man, the state of the evidence about this. Whether you'd say, there's there's is there sufficient evidence that something is real here that we just haven't quite figured out. So several years of walking down that path. I knew that DNA is the real answer to any solution of animal life or human life. And there were a series of people that I met on this journey that were absolutely ultra credible. Many of them didn't wanna talk about it, many of them didn't want to be visible about it. But all of them said. Yeah, we're in on this. Let's let's get the DNA, and George I gotta thank you that many years ago you brought on and at my request a PHD named Melba Ketchum, and Dr Ketchum was one of the few people in the world that was willing to go into the lab and DNA test hairs, tissue, blood, etc. That we'd bring in and on your show. We said, hey, we need other samples from throughout North America to test to kind of get a cross section of what we're dealing with. And that led to one hundred and ten samples being submitted many of them were were hair, and with the hair, you need, the follicle to get the might of Conrail DNA, and then other people came forward with a tissue. Sample blood saliva and all of this Melba worked through incredibly well to figure out the solution and the chemical way to extract in read this DNA. And the amazing part was is that we got nuclear DNA. And what this showed was that the five head went back twelve to fifteen thousand years on the female side to the Arab region to Jerusalem to Jordan into that part of the world..