And i just got to say talk about like world. Historical cowardice from william bar. William more knows what the guys up to william bar could have gone public but he leaves rights and utterly like preposterous encomium to the greatness of donald trump knowing full well the man is attempting a coup essentially in the moment and then just hands over the job of protecting american democracies from said khuda. Jeffrey rosen and pieces out work buddy. Yeah and it's it. You know up until the sycophantic resignation letter and and him leaving you know he did actually stand up to trump on this one issue. He was his lackey accomplice for two years. But on this issue he said there was no evidence of election fraud and that did set the stage. I think for. Jeffrey rosen to be able to push back a little bit so i. I am no fan of bill bar but i actually think on this topic. Other than advocating the throne. Yes speak he did resist. That's true and maybe it's because i'm a journalist and because i have a television show that this occurs to me and it doesn't occur to functionaries department says but like no one goes public. Everyone just plays a good soldier and doesn't say anything the guys rattling the cage trying to overturn election for the love of god say something publicly that just me daniel goldman thank you very much appreciate it. Donald trump to campaigns earned tire presidency keeping his tax returns hidden. Today we found out the game of keep away may finally be over decision to withhold. Donald trump's tax returns from house. Democrats has been reversed by the garland justice department and so the man's taxes must be released congress. What happens when they get them. Does this mean the public will get to see them. And why is this happening now. Don't go anywhere that's coming up next. Can you give us any insight into what the real reason is that. The president has refused to release his tax returns statements that he had said to me that what he didn't want to have an entire group of think tanks that our tax experts run through his tax return and start ripping it to pieces and then he'll end up in an audit and until ultimately have tax deductible consequences penalties and so on now. Wrong not wrong. Donald trump managed to keep his tax returns secret his entire time in office which was no small feat. Democrats have been trying to access them for years. Twenty seventeen congressman bill pascrell of new jersey. Ask the chairman of the tax writing house ways and means committee to formally request ten years of trump's tax returns. The chairman was republican. You shut down the upper where republicans lost control the house for your later. Congressman richard neal. A democrat from massachusetts became chair of that committee giving him legal authority under statute to formally request trump's tax returns and a few months after being sworn in. He knows he would be doing just that. The irs miss the deadline to hand them over. Neil issued subpoenas to both the treasury department in the irs. When that didn't work he sued then in september. Two thousand nine hundred and haton district attorney sivan's got into the act subpoenaing. Trump's accounting firm for eight years of attackers trump took that matter always supreme court while continuing to challenge the oversight powers the house ways and means committee and he lost the election shortly after he lost a supreme court case in february. This year. The supreme court allowed manhattan prosecutors to obtain trump's taxes. They haven't early this month. Trump's company and its top money man were charged of course with tax fraud in manhattan court today however the ways and means committee finally got some movement on their years. Long quest the justice department on america arlen said that trump's tax returns must be released to congress which means soon they could potentially even be made public betcha. Woodrow's swan national political reporter for politico has been tracking these developments and she joins me now so betsy minor standing there was a an opinion from the kind of it's kind of like the supreme court inside the justice the office legal counsel c which gives a legal direction that basically that office overturned previous set guidance that was offered during the trump administration is that right. That's right when trump's lawyers were in charge of the office of legal counsel bay said that members of congress were acting in bad faith even though congress claims to have a legitimate legislative purpose they actually just one of the tax returns to embarrass trump. Therefore treasury didn't have to give them to congress that was the trump. Doj's argument now that it's biden's lawyers who are running doj including this office of legal counsel. What they've said is look even if some members of congress are hoping that the president will be embarrassed by the contents of his tax returns. Hard to imagine why he would be. Maybe some of them are hoping that what what doj says even if they are hoping that it's not germane to the question of whether or not congress actually has a legitimate legislative reason to reach for these tax returns and doj the llc within the justice department confirmed that yes they do have a legitimate legislative reason. One really fun piece of history with all the good. That's cited in the doj opinion. Is that the reason. Congress got the power to pick individual people's tax returns. The reasons specifically this committee did is because of bribery corruption scandal. The law was changed in nineteen twenty four because congressional investigators during the teapot dome scandal. Which involved bribery belt that they were getting stiff armed by the irs. They carry that investigation out. They changed the law and the first time. A member of president's cabinet went to prison was the result of that scandal. So there's a pretty direct through line from the reason. Congress has this power to what they're trying to do with the power today. Yeah the i always found the justifications on the other side fairly tortured that they had to do with that congress's acting in bad faith. There had to be this legislative intent. It always seemed obvious to me..